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A Liberal HS Teachers Views on MEChA
A Washington State HS Teacher | 7/30/02 | Vets_Husband_and_Wife

Posted on 07/30/2002 12:50:57 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife

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To: Spiff
Glenn Spencer correctly points out: "Those who attacked us on the Fourth of July were in large part made up of groups which are supporting the right of Mexican nationals to enter the United States illegally. Moreover, they support the claim of Mexico and Mexican nationals to territory of the United States of America" - specifically the Southwest United States, which they refer to as "Aztlan" - the mythical homeland of the Aztec nation."

" The effort to mobilize street gangs is getting some help from an interesting source: the new self-anointed leader of America's "black community," Louis Farrakhan of the Nation of Islam."

"On April 27th of this year, approximately 500 representatives of black and Mexican gangs met in the Watts section of Los Angeles for the fourth annual LA Gang Truce Rally - a celebration of Mexican and black gang unity. Gang colors and "Black Power" symbols were displayed alongside symbols of the "Aztlan Nation." The event featured a speech by Tony Muhammad, the West Coast representative of the Nation of Islam. Repeatedly emphasizing that he was conveying a personal message from Farrakhan, Muhammad urged the gangsters to unite in a common armed struggle against bourgeois society:"

" When we come together as one army, we can take Watts, we can take South-Central, we can take Los Angeles and then the West Coast, because God is going to send the Original Man. And when I say the Original Man that includes Mexicans - that includes La Raza - that includes the Brown, that includes the Yellow. God is going to bring us together, and from that he is going to raise a mighty army that's ready to move for God. So I'm not telling you to give up your weapons. I'm just telling you to turn them somewhere else."

"Farrakhan himself extolled the virtues of La Raza during his speech at the Washington DC "Million Man March." Addressing white Americans, Farrakhan declared, "I know you call [some Hispanics] 'illegal aliens,' but hell, you took Texas from them, by flooding Texas with people that got your mind. And now they're coming back across the border, to what is northern Mexico: Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, and California. They don't see themselves as illegal aliens; I think they might see you as an illegal alien."

"Like Mike Davis, Farrakhan has recognized the revolutionary potential of a "nation within a nation." During his month-long "World Friendship Tour" earlier this year, in which he visited Iran, Nigeria, Sudan, Libya, Iraq, and Syria, Farrakhan opened a correspondence with Libyan terror chief Moammar Khadafy. The dictator reportedly promised Farrakhan $1 billion to help "mobilize oppressed minorities to play a significant role in American political life." "Our confrontations with America used to be like confronting a fortress from outside," Khadafy declared. "Today, we have found a loophole to enter the fortress and confront it within."

"Farrakhan will not be left hurting for revolutionary seed money. The Nation of Islam has received an estimated $20 million in federal contracts for providing security at public housing facilities."

"We are seeing the beginnings of a new civil war."

"Michaels recalled that "most of the money that the original Panthers collected came from white people, business people, and celebrities. They also received a lot of support from the Peace and Freedom Party, who were mostly white anti-war activists who saw a need for their struggle to be entrenched in the African culture and community here." He also recalled the nexus between the Panthers and the Weather Underground, a hard-core Maoist terror network that connected the Panthers, the American Indian Movement, and other domestic subversive groups to the Terrorist International. "The Weathermen - those people were cold," Michaels mused admiringly. "They were white guys who said that all white people deserved to die, including the white children. They said that they should kill white children because if they grow up, they'll be racist just like their mothers and fathers, which was a very intelligent analysis. The SDS [Students for a Democratic Society] was the same way."

"Predictably, mainstream media mavens fell over themselves to offer McGee a forum to promote urban guerrilla warfare. Speaking on 60 Minutes, McGee explained that "when I say I want to wage urban guerrilla warfare, I ain't talking about Saudi Arabia. I'm talking about right here in our home court." When interviewer Mike Wallace inquired, "What kind of violence does the Black Militia have in mind?" McGee elaborated: "Sniping at tires going on the freeway, sabotage, tearing down electrical wires. You know, complete chaos and confusion outside of our community."

AMERICANS SHOULD BE AFRAID.. VERY VERY AFRAID. WE NEED TO "WAKE UP" TO THESE RADICAL GROUPS, THEY ARE ORGANIZING AND WE ARE NOT PREPARED TO COUNTER THEM.


81 posted on 07/30/2002 5:04:41 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: A Navy Vet
It's an alarming concept and movement. As I said, the infrastructure is here, how convienient to just walk in and own it, huh?

Amazing!

Again, we live in an area where there are Hispanic, East Indians, Korean, American Indians, Irish, Polish, etc. Just an extremely diverse city. I have the UTMOST respect for the people I mentioned above. We are extremely blessed, and lucky I guess, to really "get it". We don't fight, and we smile and are polite to each other, we are neighbors.

As an example, I let people go in front of me while driving, and they do likewise, with a wave, smile and a nod. If a baby bumps into us while in the supermarket.. we smile and laugh. We just get along.

But this group is dangerous. And to think a TEACHER who brags of her Masters degree, and superior knowledge doesn't comprehend what they want, well, I find that frightening.

I also have seen the cesspool that Mexico is, we had a revolt to develop our country. They should try it. It comes down to someone wanting another hand out. Pure and simple. Poor me, give it to me free.

Many AMERICANS work hard. Be they "any" nationality. To say we OWE anything to anyone is ludicrous, and self defeating. As long as they are here legally, and treat this country well and are good citizens, then all are welcome. But this group, and illegal aliens are horrendous threat to the well being of our Nation. As are extremist Muslims, like Farrahkan!! They smile at us, but all the while they organize right in front of our own eyes,..and more importantly,.. they hate!
82 posted on 07/30/2002 5:17:07 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
Thanks for posting this. YOU are right, not your niece. This is a racist, anti-American group. She is their dupe, their "useful idiot."

This is why I have told my sons that, when they have children, I will help them and their wives home school.

83 posted on 07/30/2002 5:17:50 PM PDT by Inkie
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To: Inkie
I TOTALLY understand you wanting to homeschool. While I have a few other relatives working in Public schools, it only takes one like her, to influence a TON of kids. Think about how many classes she has a quarter,.. times 35? Times 4. Scary indeed.

School teachers should be A-Political. But even another neice of mine said something wierd the other day. I was mentioning how sad it was that the forest fires were threatening our OLD GROWTH Redwood forrests. She said "Well, Reagan should be happy". I said "What?" "Reagan?,.. you mean PRESIDENT REAGAN?".. and she said "Yeah". I asked her what she was talking about.. so she said it is in the History books. That they talk about how President Reagan stated "Whats one Redwood?"

She even went to a website with Reagan quotes! I told her that the quote was taken totally out of context. That there are REDWOOD tree's in the ENTIRE Pacific Northwest. That President Reagan was obviously talking about Logging and new growth tree's. To SHOW ME where he was talking OLD GROWTH FORREST.

And yes.. she is a TEACHER too. :o(

This explains what Thomas Sowell calls the dumbing down of the American Education system.

I know there are good teachers out there.. but this trend is frightening.
84 posted on 07/30/2002 5:29:08 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
After reading the MEChA manifesto,it's clear to me, that you took excerpts, removed them from their context, and injected your own ideas, thus presenting them to everyone you sent them to, as factual information. This is pure propaganda, and it is not the way to "educate" people. In doing so, I feel that you have perpetuated the same type of hate mail that you were attempting to fight by sending out your anti-MEChA message. And with reference to your taking issue with the use of the word "demand" throughout the manifesto, I think it's necessary to remember that this group of people is trying to fight oppression, and it's not really possible to do so by asking politely "please stop oppressing our people."

Huh? What ALTERNATE UNIVERSE does your niece live in? I posted the link to the MEChA website. When you go there they CLEARLY state that they want to take over AZTLAN (Southwest USA) and kick the "evil Europeans" out. There is no reading OUT OF CONTEXT as your niece contends. They are very IN YOUR FACE with their demands. BTW, how are folks of Mexican descent being "oppressed?" Your niece justs accepts that assumption (without specifying the "oppression") and says it must be fought (even though we are never told the details of this mythic oppression).

They are demanding education - primarily help within the university system to promote their people's job skills and education levels so that they can rise up and stand on their own feet and not depend on the welfare system, etc.

So who's keeping them from going to college? Actually MEChA's BIG DEMAND (which your niece doesn't want to face) is that the Southwest USA (AZTLAN) be turned over to them. I'm still waiting for your niece's answer on that. I really hope she won't insult us by pretending that AZTLAN is just some symbolic mythological place. The fact is it is clearly defined by the boundaries around the states in the Southwest USA. The map is even on this thread.

I truly hope that you will reconsider your opinions about these people, or if not that, at least stop sending out such e-mails that are filled with propaganda and sentiments against a group of people, in order to cause others to feel threatened and scare them into harboring ill-will against a group of people.

SHEESH! Talk about CONDESCENSION ("I'm MORAL and you all are just miserable hate mongers.")!!! How can you stand that attitude when your niece shows up at family reunions? Hey Teach! WHERE IS THE PROPAGANDA???!!!! It CLEARLY STATES on the MEChA website what they want. And why shouldn't we harbor "ill will" towards MEChA if they want to take over about a quarter of the USA and toss out the "evil Europeans" as they clearly state on their website. Does your niece think we shouldn't believe what they SAY on their website?

Until we've walked a mile in the other man's shoes, we have no right to criticize him...

MY GOD!!! WHAT AN IDIOT!!! Does that mean that if we haven't "walked a mile" in jackboots that we couldn't criticize the Nazis? Methinks this "teacher" is in need of a brain transplant.

and after all, we are all children of God and should feel love for each other, should we not?

Yeah, like all that love that was just oozing over at the MEChA website. < /sarcasm>.

Well, let us know what the response is from your niece. I sure hope she READS what is actually written at the MEChA website. It sure ain't pretty. Of course, she sounds like the type who will NEVER admit the possibility that she could be in error.

85 posted on 07/30/2002 5:31:52 PM PDT by PJ-Comix
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
While I have a few other relatives working in Public schools, it only takes one like her, to influence a TON of kids.

I shudder to think that she is teaching her students that it is somehow WRONG for them to call themselves "Americans."

86 posted on 07/30/2002 5:34:55 PM PDT by PJ-Comix
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife

"We are all children of God and should feel love for each other, should we not?"

87 posted on 07/30/2002 5:43:50 PM PDT by PJ-Comix
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife

"It is a conceptual homeland, rather than a true geographical location."

88 posted on 07/30/2002 5:51:48 PM PDT by PJ-Comix
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To: PJ-Comix
Well, let us know what the response is from your niece. I sure hope she READS what is actually written at the MEChA website. It sure ain't pretty. Of course, she sounds like the type who will NEVER admit the possibility that she could be in error."

I can't believe she read the SAME website as you and I did. How she garnered a different opinion, just shows she should probably never have passed classes and gotten a Masters degree. She just "diminished" the success of those teachers who have gotten one.

I won't stereotype all teachers,.. but I sure as heck pray to God she isn't the NORM. But I fear perhaps she is.

I'm hoping to hear from Summer and a few other REAL Teachers regarding this issue.

I'm all for LEGAL Immigrants, and our fellow citizens who appreciate this country and all our freedoms and rights. But I'm against people who live here and bash it. Pure and simple. America,..Love it or LEAVE it.

89 posted on 07/30/2002 5:52:57 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: summer
I mean A-Political IN THE CLASS ROOM. But it is also a teachers responsibility to research and report responsibly our nations HISTORY.

PINGING you as this relates to a fellow teachers beliefs. A Spanish teacher, who feels her masters degree gives her superior knowledge about Mexican/American history. From what I'm reading, her view is innacurate!!
90 posted on 07/30/2002 5:55:32 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
Sometimes, it's hard for us to understand what it might feel like to have someone come and take over your home, and demand that you follow their rules, and speak their language...

Au contraire. I understand perfectly what that feels like, and so do millions of other Americans. Those of us who live in border states understand it all too well.

91 posted on 07/30/2002 6:05:55 PM PDT by Nea Wood
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To: Nea Wood
Wow.. profound, and true!!! Thanks Nea!!! I'm giving this thread a few days,.. then I'm going to draft a response. I may post the draft here. I'd like input on it. I so want to respond accurately to her.
92 posted on 07/30/2002 6:11:34 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
Have your niece check out this Mecha website called LA VOZ DE AZTLAN. It's just overflowing with love. < /sarcasm>
93 posted on 07/30/2002 6:17:03 PM PDT by PJ-Comix
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To: Travis McGee
Breathe...Relax...Aim...Squeeze...

Scouts out! Cavalry Ho!

94 posted on 07/30/2002 6:18:46 PM PDT by wku man
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To: PJ-Comix
I'll do that. It will be interesting to see how LONG it takes her to muster up all this liberal rubbish in response to it this time. It took her a couple months to respond to the previous one. But I fully intend to counter this ignorance. Thanks in LARGE part to the help of people here.

How she could come away with a different interpretation than most of us have, is beyond me. Amazing...
95 posted on 07/30/2002 6:25:05 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
Here is some more reading material for your niece:

OSAMA A MEChA HERO

96 posted on 07/30/2002 6:39:06 PM PDT by PJ-Comix
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
Osama bin Laden : The "Pancho Villa" of Islam (Osama A MEChA Hero)
La Voz de AZTLAN | Janurary 15, 2002 | Ernesto Cienfuegos

Posted on 07/30/2002 7:32 PM Pacific by PJ-Comix



"Villa is everywhere but Villa is nowhere" was the telegraphed message sent to Washington D. C. by General John J. Pershing after failing to capture the elusive and brilliant military strategist of the Mexican Revolution. Pershing and his Punitive Expedition, that included a young lieutenant by the name of George S. Patton, had gone deep into Mexico in search of General Francisco Villa after Villa and about 485 of his "Dorados del Norte" had successfully crossed the U.S./Mexico border and raided the small border town of Columbus, New Mexico on March 9, 1916 to collect a debt owed him by two unscrupulous, in Villa's own words, "judio" (jewish) brothers, Sam and Louis Ravel. The scammers had failed to deliver arms, ammunition and supplies they had been paid for with gold bars. The U.S. Army Punitive Expedition consisting of 10,000 troops went as far south as Parral, Chihuahua but gave up catching General Villa after an 11 month search. General Villa, "El Tigere del Norte", proved too evasive for John "Black Jack" Pershing. General Francisco Villa knew every rock, every stream, every cave, and every cactus of the immense sierra of Chihuahua.

Today, we are hearing similar accounts concerning the search for Osama bin Laden by the U.S. Special Forces expedition into Afghanistan under the command of General Tommy Franks. Yesterday General Franks as well as the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) sent a message to President George Bush that they believe that Osama bin Laden has managed to escape. The message by the CIA said that Osama bin Laden may not be in Afghanistan or in Pakistan and that he may have escaped by sea. Like Pancho Villa, it looks like Osama bin Laden has outsmarted the U.S. military generals. Reports now being broadcast by the mainstream media say that Osama bin Laden fooled the CIA and Special Forces by "planting" videos as well as Osama bin Laden voice tape recordings that were used by Taliban soldiers over "cellular phone" communications to make the CIA think that he was at a certain location when in fact he was somewhere else. General Villa utilized similar tactics to fool Pershing. Pershing and the U.S. Punitive Expedition were chasing phantom Villas all over Chihuahua and finally became exhausted and gave up. His last telegraph to Woodrow Wilson was "Villa is everywhere but Villa is nowhere".

There are other uncanny similarities between Osama bin Laden and Francisco Villa. Both are revered by the common people of each respective community. Both are seen as Robin Hoods by the poor and oppressed. Both were construction contractors at one time in their lives. Francisco Villa was a general contractor on the construction of the railroad through Chihuahua's majestic Copper Canyon. Both Osama bin Laden and General Francisco Villa were indirectly fighting those whom they perceived to be lackeys of the United States. General Villa was fighting Venustanio Carranza, who had a cozy "sellout" relationship with Woodrow Wilson, and Osama bin Laden is fighting the Saudi Royalty who have a very cozy relationship with US oil interests to the detriment of the overall disenfranchised Arab population.

The U.S. military expedition to capture Francisco Villa was doomed to failure because Pershing and his Punitive Expedition where unfamiliar with the territory, were up against a very clever military genius, and were operating within a very hostile local population who had come to see the revolutionary as a folk hero and national symbol of defying America. General Francisco Villa was seen by Mexicans as a clear winner, emerging triumphant from a battle with the powerful United States and assumed legendary status that endures till this day. It certainly appears today, that Osama bin Laden is headed for the very same legendary and folk hero status in Islam.


97 posted on 07/30/2002 6:39:27 PM PDT by Vets_Husband_and_Wife
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
The public schools are teaching a lot of nonsensical crap. I've substitute taught a lot, and you'd be shocked if you saw the garbage that comes out of the school textbooks. What's even more shocking is that school boards have to vote on which textbooks to use.

You'll see themes ranging from multiculturalism to junk science, historical revisionism to environmentalism. The textbooks are awful. I've made sure to point out all the errors to the children.

I'll give you some examples.

In one social studies textbook, you'll quickly get a politically correct historical version of America. The textbook lies and claims that America has always been a multicultural nation, and implies that everyone who has come here has held onto their individual culture. Directly below this paragraph, you see pictures of children who are supposed to have represented America throughout history. However, they don't look American, for most are decked out in Asian, Middle Eastern, African, or whatever foreign clothing. You do see a few "American style" kids into the mix. However, they are in the minority. In fact, the textbooks portray Europeans as having been the minority throughout the U.S., both in the past and in the present.

Another example was an extreme form of junk science. The lesson plan was to work on a particular assignment within the reading and writing workbooks. Upon turning to the lesson pages, it was indicated that you were to read the story and fill in the blank spaces from a glossary of words located above in a box. The story could have been right out of the environmentalist handbook. As an individual who studied meterology in college, I quickly knew that the arguments were bogus. The story made the statement that if one were to cut down all the trees and root systems within a particular area that a desert would be the direct result. As some who knows about weather and climate, it is a fallacy to say that climate is a byproduct of vegetation. The opposite is true. Vegetation is a byproduct of the climate. Climate is based upon different criteria, including wind belts, topography, proximity to lakes, oceans and rivers, areas that experience clashes in air masses, the jet stream, etc. However, vegetation is not one of those reasons. The lesson was a way of indoctrinating the kids into believing that if you cut down the trees, everything's going to be a desert, and that life would cease to be as it is. Mind you, this was in reference to only one particular area, not the whole earth.

I've seen history/social studies textbooks give too much emphasis to the "Native Americans" and too little to our Founding Fathers. Furthermore, some of these textbooks make the colonists out to be bad people, whereas the Indians are seen as good.

I've seen history textbooks refer to Cortes as destroying the ancient government of Mexico. Though they were right in terms of the killing that went on.

I've seen "Character Assemblies" in the schools that are nothing more than a subtle form of secular humanism. I've seen third grade children singing, "You can't tell me what to do. I don't have to do what you say. What's right is what's in my mind", etc. Mind you, these assemblies are shown to the entire school, and they don't make a distinction between the authority of adults and the differences compared to children.

Yes, the schools are whacked out. The teachers discipline very little today, as they are in fear of losing their jobs. If you place a child in the corner, even if they're very disruptive and have had several warnings, the school may come after you. If you teach the children anything else that doesn't fit the PC Propaganda mold, a teacher could find his/herself placed on probation.

If it were up to me, I'd ask to keep your children out of these God-forsaken institutions, though some may be better than others.

98 posted on 07/30/2002 6:42:09 PM PDT by FreedomFriend
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
Your niece is a prime of example of one who "has let their schooling get in the way of their education." People who feel this way I've found are generally removed in many ways from the problem...just like most if not all of the pundits and politicians in our land.

In my forteen years of living in California, (east coast transplant, what a mistake!) I've watched as the Mexification has spread like a cancer. If you have no problems with trash, crime, graffiti, overcrowded housing, and a generally overburdened infrastructure, terrific, this is your place. However it's not the way I grew up and to live this way now is a huge leap backwards in my view.

I won't even bother trying to change your niece's views on this matter. All of us here will be labeled as biggoted, racist, xenophobes who need to be enlightened. I wish you much luck and patience with this "educated individual" however. Call me a defeatist but with the attitudes that prevail in at least my part of California, the Mexicans are welcome to set up Aztlan and in fact will even get government aid to do so. The fight is lost...I'm outta here.

99 posted on 07/30/2002 6:42:43 PM PDT by amstaff1
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To: Vets_Husband_and_Wife
(I don't like using the term "American" to refer to only those from the United States, as all who live in North, Central and South America are Americans. It's unfortunate that our language doesn't have a word for people from the United States other than American - in Spanish we are called "estadounidenses" or United Statesmen)


I suppose some will call for changing the name of the United States of America because it offends people and isn't diverse enough.

100 posted on 07/30/2002 6:48:01 PM PDT by bok
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