Shoot-out ends in death of cop,suspect

Chicago Sun-Times ^ | BY FRANK MAIN, FRAN SPIELMAN AND ANDREW HERRMANN STAFF REPORTERS

[Tennessee_Bob]

Mental illness is not an excuse to kill, but neither is intruding in someones home acceptable.

On the other hand, is mental illness an excuse to ignore six court hearings and a subpoena? I'm not saying that anyone should have been shot and killed - I think it's a shame. However, the two police officers were trying to enforce the law and the orders of the court. The civilian was ignoring those laws, as well as the laws regarding the upkeep and safety of the house.

[latina4dubya]

"He would bend over backwards to make sure there was no confrontation... he was always prepared." well, busting into someone's home with a sledgehammer is about as confronting as you can get... and not wearing a vest--he wasn't so prepared this time... this was handled terribly... it's almost like the sending the BATF with tanks and machine guns to handle a bunch of cult members waiting for the battle of armegeddon... but on a much smaller scale... very sad, indeed...

[JimRed]

How he maintained or did not maintain his property was nobody's business but his. He was not directly harming any of his neighbors...

That's o.k. in a rural setting where you can't see the next neighbor down the street, or can't see the house from the street. Let his place rot and fall down for all I care. But in a normal urban/suburban setting he is adversely affecting the property values of all of his neighbors. He does NOT have a right to do that!

[arm958]

Now two men are dead because the government didn't know when to stop intruding in people's lives and invading their property.

You are a first class idiot. The old man let his placed go to sh*t, wouldn't take GENEROUS offers of help from anyone, pissed off his neighbors, and then pulled out a gun and murdered a cop who was woing his job well! I'm glad the bastard is dead, but I morn for the cop and his four children. You are a disgrace.

[Askel5]

About 10 p.m.,

No joke.

[coloradan]

"Statism is a religion of peace."

[Conservababe]

But in a normal urban/suburban setting he is adversely affecting the property values of all of his neighbors. He does NOT have a right to do that!

I am beginning to truly believe that all our constitutional rights are going down the drain due to...fools like you spouting the PROPERTY VALUES right...which does not exist.

[coloradan]

Great summary!

[cynicom]

When the cop resorted to force, breaking down the door, he should have been professional enough to know that force might well be met with force.. Too bad anyone died but it is a travesty that we use force on 77 year old people. There had to be another way. Anyone that decries "obey the law", should justify the two deaths, I cannot.

[Copernicus]

Usually the elderly person is taken into protective custody and hauled off to a nursing home and sedated while city inspectors loot the place of cash and valubles; then the dumpster shows up and some contractor cousin of another city employee throws a lifetime's worth of possessions away and boards up the property; they lien the property for the work and scoop the real estate through a court appointed "guardian" (usually a politically wired attorney).

Agreed. This is the vicious untold corruption that underlies the Nanny State. You will see this occur more frequently as a certain percentage of the population refuse to relinquish their sovereignty to an increasingly corrupt government.

With all the crack houses and slum lords floating around the city housing authority just "happens" to pick on a self sustaining older citizen who asks only to be let alone for the housing equivalent of spitting on the sidewalk.

Look at what happened here- an elderly man successfully (partially) defended himself against a home invasion conducted after dark with a .22 pistol?

Absolutely, this stinks to high heaven. Best regards,

[Hard Case]

The old man let his placed go to sh*t....

So letting one's own place go to sh*t should be a jailable offense?

[Teacher317]

I can see some thirsty lawyer getting ready to argue that the lederly gentleman had some syndrome that kept him from ging outside.

[MissAmericanPie]

Wow, what salty shooting by a 77 year old.

[cynicom]

Perhaps you are correct. However does the STATE have the right to bring forth a situation that causes the two deaths.

My neighbors house needs painting, maybe the "STATE" should apply some strongarm pressure on her to get it done. She cannot afford it but that gives her no right to not paint it. Maybe they can haul her into court a few times, serves her right.

[Redcloak]

Why are we doing a "dynamic entry" over a housing court subpoena?

[Teacher317]

and I have some syndrome that doesn't catch typos on the first preview... D'oh!

(Can I sue someone for that?)

[Teacher317]

He was refusing to submit to authority... among the worst offenses, in the eyes of many. (Not me)

[Loopy]

Not supposed to. That's solely(meaning other courts are pre-empted) John Ashcroft's job. I've been studying Immigration Law lately and I can say that with certainty.

[spodefly]

Spot on appraisal of the situation, at least as gleaned from the article.

It used to be that the 'cranky old neighbor' was left alone to live out his life, but we have all become so inured to the vagaries of the state that some (even on FR) see this as a case where the police and the courts did the right thing. WRONG!

Anyone that cannot see that the police and courts had no damn business messing with a property owner (kookie or not) who did nothing to harm anyone else (property values are not justification for this!) should have their head examined ... they are way more dangerous than a 77 year old man living out his life in his home.