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Don't meddle, China tells US in Bibles row
scmp ^ | January 9, 2002 | GREG TORODE in Washington and STELLA LEE

Posted on 01/08/2002 6:41:52 PM PST by super175

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This Torode guy is a bona fide idiot.
1 posted on 01/08/2002 6:41:53 PM PST by super175
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To: super175; *Christian persecutio
Bump List
2 posted on 01/08/2002 6:45:30 PM PST by Free the USA
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To: All
I forgot to mention that there was a political cartoon attached to this portraying GWB as a "crusader".

It has GWB wearing a big cowboy hat and rolling up his sleeve saying "Whaddya know? Another crusade!" and on the side is says "Steady George"

3 posted on 01/08/2002 6:45:37 PM PST by super175
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To: super175
YEP! he is a idiot but we have been soft on China.
4 posted on 01/08/2002 6:50:22 PM PST by Cold Heat
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To: super175
" "Actually, it's not a case of smuggling Bibles. The Bibles were used as a pretext. They smuggled a large amount of cult publications," he said. "It's being dealt with according to the law." -- article

Must be some of that "laizzez-faire stuff." It always stirs up the hornet's nest.

5 posted on 01/08/2002 6:53:35 PM PST by Buckeroo
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To: super175
>>Mr Bush had asked the State Department to make urgent inquiries into the plight of businessman Lai Kwong-keung

Why should a hongkong person bother the US government?

6 posted on 01/08/2002 6:55:24 PM PST by Lake
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Comment #7 Removed by Moderator

To: Lake
It has absolutely nothing to do with where that person originated from. It has everything to do with the abuse of power and discrimination. We don't want to do business with people who believe in either.

Your line of reasoning leads one to think "this person is a subject of the Communist Party, and hence the Communist Party can do whatever they want to him."

The thinking that 'this is only one person, why worry' is barbaric.

8 posted on 01/08/2002 7:17:29 PM PST by super175
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To: super175
How is this any different than when the Euro-trash badmouth the US for still having the death penalty?? We sure don't appreciate the Euros telling us what to do, why should the Chinese feel any different?
9 posted on 01/08/2002 7:21:44 PM PST by dfwgator
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To: wirestripper; Hopalong
I think we have been soft too, but there must be caution exercised with that.

Unexplained hardness won't be productive. Being difficult for no reason other than being difficult is not good. It must be accompanied with incentives, learning, education, and a clear cut message about what we expect.

If someone whipped their kid and did not tell him why, or without trying to do any find outs or teaching, then the whole learning process is out the door.

If we want long term better results, we have to mix our hardness with something, and be clear and consistent about it.

10 posted on 01/08/2002 7:27:16 PM PST by super175
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To: super175
>>We don't want to do business with people who believe in either.

The US has trade relations with almost all counties in the world. Ther are abuse of pwoer and discriminations in many countries, including the US itself. So you don't want to trade with them?

>>Your line of reasoning leads one to think "this person is a subject of the Communist Party, and hence the Communist Party can do whatever they want to him."

No, the person is a Chinese citizen, not a subject of the CCP. I don't thnk the US government should get involved in the case.

11 posted on 01/08/2002 7:30:08 PM PST by Lake
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To: super175
?? Bibles ??,.......?? Bibles ??

Maybe, these 'bibles' are NOT really the "BIBLE"
(Must be KJV,...66 books, or from NT=Textus Receptus Text, OT=Massoretic Text, MUST include 1st John 5:7 IN THE SUBSTANCE of the TEXT and NOT in a margin or footnote,...etc.)

?? Bibles ?? BIBLES=THE ONLY HOLY SCRIPTURE
ANYTHING 'other' than the 'above' is NOT a part of THE HOLY SCRIPTURE........Period!!

12 posted on 01/08/2002 7:38:16 PM PST by maestro
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To: dfwgator
The 'appreciation' might not be any different, but the offense sure is.

America, me especially has no fundamental problem with the death penalty. Just so long as their is ample evidence that makes it known for 100% that a person is guilty of some heineious crime, I say light em up.

I am not opposed to the Chinese giving the death penalty as long as the proof is there and there has been a fair trial and proceedings, including no planting false evidence or whatever.

Some of those Europeans have a fundamental problem with the state, any state putting people to death for any reason at all. With them, Osama killed 3,000 people, but you still could not execute him. With that, no war is justified, ever, even the one against Hitler, which saved the European's asses. Their argument is fundamentally flawed.

Where to draw the line now is a different matter.

The punishment itself is not what is in question here, it is the law that persecutes someone for doing something so basic as believe in a religion.

You have state sanctioned persecution of religion. Anything they think that you should not believe in, sorry.

It is a monumental abuse of power. It goes against the very tenets of basic humanity. The basic freedom to choose ones belief system is accepted world-wide, except in China and some other power abusive systems. They can't be having anything that competes with their political power.

They are choosing political power in a flawed system over protecting of people, which protecting the people is what governments are designed for in the first place.

13 posted on 01/08/2002 7:41:48 PM PST by super175
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To: super175
I don't want us to be nice to them. They don't respond like a dog does or a child. They do however respect strength, consistency and clarity. The Clintons blew this on all counts. Bush will do better but I was somewhat disapointed with the handling of the EP-3 affair. I thought the proper course of action would have been to destroy the aircraft after our people were returned.

Perhaps Bush was giving them a chance to correct the error of their ways before using stronger measures.

14 posted on 01/08/2002 7:44:49 PM PST by Cold Heat
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To: Old Hickory
I certainly hope your comments fall under the heading of extreme sarcasm.

I have made an honest effort to buy USA made products, and would gladly pay more, but all I can find on my shopping list is 'made in China'.

The good news is (I think) we stand a better chance of addressing their poor humanitarian ethics with some kind of trade agreement in place. Capitalism is slowly spreading in China so that hopefully one day their economy will be so dependent on trade that they will mend their ways. I don't like giving them favored trade nation status as yet, though, and don't understand Bush's allowing this to occur.

It is hopeful that trade will further open the lines of communication so that maybe we won't ever have to see whose nukes are more powerful.

15 posted on 01/08/2002 7:49:51 PM PST by bjcintennessee
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To: super175
The U.S. is expressing concern to the commie chinese! Wow, after giving them Most Favoured Nation status. I am sure they are wetting their pants like those terrorist thugs and their ilk running around freely in the U.S. despite 911.
16 posted on 01/08/2002 7:53:12 PM PST by TransOxus
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To: Lake
China has no system of law. Everything is based on facism, the state over the people.

The US has trade relations with almost all counties in the world. Ther are abuse of pwoer and discriminations in many countries, including the US itself.

America is not being hypocritical about it at all. Over the past 200 years America has experienced so much improvements in basic human rights. It amazes me that a black man is now Secretary of State. A Chinese lady is Secretary of Labor, that says a lot right there. Went from working on the railroads to one of the top posts in the government. We have Mexican lawyers in the White House even.

America has definately kept the door open, and said something about its own record, and did something about it too. No one is immune, but at least we put our money where our mouth is.

I think America can and should say something about it, because it has the best interest of the people at hand, unlike the power abusive authorities in China.

America has set the tone with its own actions, but Chinese authorities don't feel the need to jump on the train and join in.

Finally though, you gotta ask yourself this one question: If you saw your neighbor out on his front lawn beating his wife and kids, would you still have respect for him? Would you still be friends with him?

There are such things as common rules and standards of conduct.

China must decide, are they going to be part of the civilized world or not?

17 posted on 01/08/2002 7:59:31 PM PST by super175
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To: maestro
I really hope you're being sarcastic. Sadly, it's hard to tell around here lately.
18 posted on 01/08/2002 8:03:06 PM PST by B Knotts
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To: super175
Remember those halcyon days when we didn't allow China to tell us anything???
19 posted on 01/08/2002 8:08:17 PM PST by brat
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To: wirestripper
They definately respect strength. I agree with that one for sure.

I do however feel that there are at least some people who want to come to a common understanding...

20 posted on 01/08/2002 8:10:22 PM PST by super175
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