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Passenger Plane Crash in Queens NYC!
Fox News ^

Posted on 11/12/2001 5:30:38 AM PST by Attila_the_Hun

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To: Central Scrutiniser
Explain how engine failure is consistent with what Mayor Giuliani reported. There is the main crash site, the site two blocks away with the engine, a part of the wing and possibly tail in Jamaica Bay, and another site with unspecified debris several blocks away.
781 posted on 11/12/2001 9:26:13 AM PST by Lessismore
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Comment #782 Removed by Moderator

To: Central Scrutiniser
planes crash all the time

I believe the statistic is that major airliners average two crashes a year.

So let us start the count since after September 11--I count one so far the first day in month 3.

Just a little bit ahead of schedule--oops, forgot that plane that crashed in Russia--remember the one where the Russians accused the Ukranians of shooting it down.

So, we now have had our supply of crashes for an average year in the last two months and one day.

Statistically impossible, no. But a couple of more "accidents" in the next few months would begin to get the attention of a statistician who didn't work for the government. ;-)
783 posted on 11/12/2001 9:26:50 AM PST by cgbg
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To: Central Scrutiniser
Don't listen to all the ignorant posters who are just dying to find some grand conspiracy in all this

Unfortunately, they're the same ones who didn't believe that the Florida anthrax case wasn't an isolated incident as was officially reported for a while...

784 posted on 11/12/2001 9:27:25 AM PST by Elenya
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To: Central Scrutiniser
Turbine failure...I said that some 300 posts ago...saw it happen a few times while I was a jet engine mechanic in the Air Force. I put more faith in a catastrophic engine failure than the theory that some guy on the ground took it out with a rifle, or a stinger, or anything else.

Jet engines are tough, but not nearly as tough as some folks (especially those that have no experience on them) believe.

785 posted on 11/12/2001 9:27:49 AM PST by Tennessee_Bob
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Comment #786 Removed by Moderator

To: 5by5
It doesn't matter if the aircraft are piloted or pilotless if they can be overridden from the ground.

We have an override from the ground now: scramble the jets and shoot it. The same level of security that results in scrambling the jets can be achieved in overriding the pilot with software.

Testing a security system doesn't compromise the security of its implementation because in production the encryption keys are different.

787 posted on 11/12/2001 9:29:16 AM PST by annalex
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To: Central Scrutiniser
Major Plane Crashes in the Last 20 Years

-Sept. 11, 2001: American Airlines Flight 11 en route from Boston to Los Angeles is hijacked and crashes into the World Trade Center; 92 killed.

-Sept. 11, 2001: United Flight 175 en route from Boston to Los Angeles is hijacked and crashes into the World Trade Center; 65 killed.

-Sept. 11, 2001: American Flight 77 en route from Washington's Dulles International Airport to Los Angeles is hijacked and crashes into the Pentagon; 64 killed.

-Sept. 11, 2001: United Airlines Flight 93 en route from Newark, N.J., to San Francisco is hijacked and crashes near Pittsburgh; 44 killed.

-Oct. 31, 2000: Singapore Airlines jumbo jet slams into an object before takeoff for Los Angeles and bursts into flames; 81 killed.

-July 25, 2000: Air France Concorde headed to New York crashes into hotel outside Paris shortly after takeoff; 113 killed.

-July 17, 2000: Alliance Air Boeing 737-200 crashes into houses during second landing attempt at Patna, India; 51 killed.

-April 19, 2000: Air Philippines flight from Manila crashes on approach to Davao, Philippines; 131 killed.

-Jan. 31, 2000: Alaska Airlines Flight 261 plunges into ocean off Southern California on flight from Mexico to San Francisco; 88 killed.

-Jan. 30, 2000: Kenya Airways A-310 crashes into Atlantic Ocean shortly after takeoff from Abidjan, Ivory Coast, to Lagos, Nigeria; 169 killed.

-Oct. 31, 1999: Egypt Air Boeing 767 crashes into Atlantic after taking off from John F. Kennedy Airport in New York on flight to Cairo, Egypt; 217 killed.

-Feb. 24, 1999: China Southwest Airlines plane crashes in field in China's coastal Zhejiang province; 61 killed.

-Dec. 11, 1998: Thai Airways International A-310 crashes on domestic flight during third landing attempt at Surat Thani, Thailand; 101 killed.

- Sept. 2, 1998: Swissair Flight 111 from New York to Geneva crashes off Nova Scotia; 229 killed.

-Feb. 16, 1998: Airbus A-300 owned by Taiwan's China Airlines crashes near Taipei's Chiang Kai-shek airport while trying to land after flight from Bali, Indonesia; 196 killed.

-Feb. 2, 1998: Cebu Pacific Air DC-9 crashes into mountain in southern Philippines; 104 killed.

- Aug. 5, 1997: A Korean Airlines Boeing 747 crashes near Guam Island; 228 killed.

- Nov. 12, 1996: Saudi 747 collides shortly after takeoff with a Kazak Ilyushin-76 making its landing approach; 349 killed.

- July 17, 1996: TWA Flight 800, a Paris-bound 747, explodes and crashes off New York's Long Island shortly after takeoff from Kennedy International; 230 killed.

- Dec. 21, 1988: Pan Am Boeing 747 crashes in terrorist bombing over Lockerbie, Scotland; 270 killed.

- Nov. 28, 1987: South African Airways 747 crashes off the island of Mauritius in the Indian Ocean; 160 killed.

- Aug. 12, 1985: Japan Air Lines 747 crashes into a mountain on a domestic flight; 520 killed.

- June 23, 1985: Air India Boeing 747 crashes off the coast of Ireland because of terrorist-planted bomb; 329 killed.

- Nov. 27, 1983: Avianca Boeing 747 crashes near Madrid's Barajas airport; 183 killed.

- Sept. 1, 1983: Korean Air Lines 747 shot down by a Soviet fighter after flying through Soviet airspace near Sakhalin Island; 269 killed.

AP-ES-11-12-01 1226EST

788 posted on 11/12/2001 9:29:51 AM PST by callisto
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To: cgbg
This posted on Newsmax:

Mechanical Trouble Reported Before Take-Off

An American Airlines A-300 reported mechanical trouble while waiting to take off Monday morning, about an hour before it crashed just outside News York's JFK Airport.

AA Flight 587 was scheduled to take off at 8:00 a.m. but was held on the ground for an hour and fifteen minutes to repair an unidentified mechanical problem, a travel agent familiar with the flight told WABC Radio.

Additionally, a United Airlines pilot says he over-heard a radio report from Flight 587's pilot saying he was experiencing engine trouble before the plane exploded in mid-air over New York's Jamaica Bay.

The Bush administration has announced the FBI believes that Flight 587 did explode in mid-air and is working to determine the cause.

789 posted on 11/12/2001 9:29:57 AM PST by nicmarlo
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To: Osinski
>Well, put a fork in the Thanksgiving holiday air travel...

By a freakish twist-of-date, this year Thanksgiving is _also_ the anniversary of the Kennedy assassination. If there _is_ a left wing element to the on-going terrorist activity in the US, they may make a point of this year's JFK anniversary...

Mark W.

790 posted on 11/12/2001 9:30:25 AM PST by MarkWar
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To: mafree
Don't fly. It's not worth the risk, trains or buses would be far safer or else drive.
791 posted on 11/12/2001 9:31:31 AM PST by FITZ
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To: Blueflag
If you're talking about the picture on post 695, I can see a shaft and hub in the picture. If you look to the left of the police officer facing the camera, there's what appears to be a compressor drive shaft just to the left of his holster (on his right hip). The firefighter is standing in front of what would be the mount location for the wing pylon.
792 posted on 11/12/2001 9:33:06 AM PST by Tennessee_Bob
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To: Attila_the_Hun
Engines fall off of American A-300 Airbuses all the time...

"And while organized terrorism has not been ruled out, so far we have found no direct link to organized terrorism."- FBI Director Robert S. Mueller III

793 posted on 11/12/2001 9:33:23 AM PST by Terrorista Nada
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To: michigander
One woman just interviewed on Fox, had plane parts hit her garage, she was able to get out of the house with her kids...she said when she heard the explosion then looked out her doorwall and saw a fireball crash down on her backyard neighbors home, she thought it was an attack of some kind.

The fireball and the fact that the plane fell in multiple peices in different areas sure sounds like an explosion or bomb.

794 posted on 11/12/2001 9:35:06 AM PST by mostlyundecided
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To: Central Scrutiniser
Re #784:

Should read:
Unfortunately, they're the same ones who didn't believe that the Florida anthrax case was an isolated incident as was officially reported for a while...

795 posted on 11/12/2001 9:35:36 AM PST by Elenya
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To: TankerKC
"Leave it to MindBender26 and Lawdude--they are the only Freepers authorized to speculate."

I have not speculated in the least. I merely ask that people base their comments on FACT. Your sources, oh mighty know-it-all?

As I type this, MY comments seem based on better information than yours. Now, back to work.

796 posted on 11/12/2001 9:37:14 AM PST by lawdude
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To: GeorgeandtheDralgore
No one is dying to find a grand conspiracy in anything. We just want the truth - not some "wild goose" story. It's either safe to fly or it isn't. I would think that along with the increased security, mechanical maintenance would be well scrutinzed also. What are the odds of another American airliner crashing outside NYC (near the Long Island coast yet again) nearly two months to day of 911 during a period of high alert status while the UN is in session a week after a threat? There have certainly been enough reports lately on the vulnerability of the baggage check system.
797 posted on 11/12/2001 9:38:07 AM PST by freeperfromnj
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To: GeorgeandtheDralgore
No one is dying to find a grand conspiracy in anything. We just want the truth - not some "wild goose" story. It's either safe to fly or it isn't. I would think that along with the increased security, mechanical maintenance would be well scrutinzed also. What are the odds of another American airliner crashing outside NYC (near the Long Island coast yet again) nearly two months to day of 911 during a period of high alert status while the UN is in session a week after a threat? There have certainly been enough reports lately on the vulnerability of the baggage check system.
798 posted on 11/12/2001 9:38:38 AM PST by freeperfromnj
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To: Tennessee_Bob
Turbine failure...I said that some 300 posts ago...saw it happen a few times while I was a jet engine mechanic in the Air Force.

Yes it looks like this possibility is more likely than terrorism. I was convinced at first that it was terrorism given a number of coincidences...but coincidences do happen. I guess we will just have to wait until the investigators have enough evidence to make conclusive statements.

799 posted on 11/12/2001 9:40:09 AM PST by WRhine
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To: freeperfromnj
Drudge Report: Flight data recorder found
800 posted on 11/12/2001 9:40:50 AM PST by callisto
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