Posted on 11/13/2015 11:31:44 AM PST by VinL
Yeah.....makes sense..
If they pass it...I assume it will die in the House....again.
I doubt the House will act until after the election. So the entire thing is a joke and a political ploy to damage Cruz.
His amendment was never intended to pass, which is why some refer to it as a poison pill.
It caused distress in the Senate, ticked off McConnell and the bill eventually just died as the result of exposure in the House...
Now, you are seeing the payback, but that too will fail.
Cruz is not for amnesty under any of your definitions. While there was a lot of Republican support for (Border first) type legislation prior to 2013, Cruz was not among them at the time.
You make a big mistake assuming he’s a amnesty supporter like Rubio, and you really need to understand that you are being played by Trump as well. He actually attacked Romney in 2012 for being far too strict and harsh on immigration...so this crap can go both ways.
I think so too.
“...As I said, it was a ploy. It was part of the fight.”
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You have the patience of Job, much more than I can muster. I did a review of the posting history of the some of those on this anti-Cruz jihad and I want to change my characterization of them as being on “an anti-Cruz jihad”...they are instead on “a HYPERACTIVE anti-Cruz jihad”.
And the funny thing is that it escapes them that Trump likely views Cruz as a natural ally and behaves accordingly by not attacking Cruz. Trump is smarter than some of his supporters who are engaging in their hyperactive anti-Cruz jihad.
I have seen many things during election season that is hard to explain much less tolerate on this forum. Some people just stop posting and lower their profile. Others take a break and sign off..
I suppose it proves the saying that getting Conservatives to cooperate in any unified way is similar to herding cats.
“Obama will veto it and embarrass Cruz in the process.”
I differ - I think a veto would be a shot nitrous oxide for Cruz’s campaign.
I don’t think the uniparty is panicked so much as seeing another opportunity to obfuscate and betray. More than likely they’ll gut the text of the bill and replace it with amnesty provisions or increases in immigration quotas.
It’s nothing personal, of course. It’s just what the uniparty does.
<<< And the funny thing is that it escapes them that Trump likely views Cruz as a natural ally and behaves accordingly by not attacking Cruz. Trump is smarter than some of his supporters who are engaging in their hyperactive anti-Cruz jihad. >>>
I think you are enduring nothing much more than Trump supporters have to take, from all sides. TRUMP supporters just believe their man is the only man who is actually a FORCE, enough to blow up the Establishment strangle hold on the conservative wing of the Republican Party.
A million times I have said if TRUMP should be taken down, no other conservative of ours has a prayer, but so far, yes, Trump and Cruz are fairly natural allies. No one hates Cruz, but he has heavy political baggage on both sides of the aisle, also among the general electorate and he does not draw moderates, and he does not have the force of personality to street fight. Never mind all the Wall Street donor types who curiously are interested in supporting him with big money. Why would they support a conservative like Cruz? Just a question.
The times require TRUMP. Cruz would get support if Hell froze over for Trump, but no one believes Cruz could actually win in a general election against a country that is half socialist.
It’s just that Cruz has more “natural” enemies located in DC, who have grudges and old scores to settle with Cruz and are not his allies on much of anything. He will get the Newt Gingrich treatment and would be a much heavier candidacy to drag over the finish line, in a general election.
You probably have that right, too. :)
Not voting in sham elections is very easy. Even in a swing state.
Not sure how an Obama veto of a bill that most voting Americans want to see go into law would embarrass Cruz. I’d think it would elevate his stature and demonstrate once more that he is the principal opponent to this lawless tyrant.
I think we are on the same page. I was looking at it from more of a campaign issue, to try to take the issue away from Trump and Cruz.
You are emphasizing the issue itself, and I agree with your analysis.
Ladies, sumthin’s afoot, with Trump and Cruz.
1. The other day, Trump went after Carson. I posted a thread, because I didn’t understand why. Carson blocks Cruz (and others) in Iowa; so he’s of help to Trump. If Trump brings Carson down, Carson’s voters go to Cruz and others; not Trump.
2. Then, Cruz, prematurely it seemed, went after Rubio on immigration. But, it became clear this attack was well coordinated. Cruz got an info-mercial with Laura Ingraham, followed by strong anti- Rubio pieces by Brietbart, Dan Horowitz, and another puff, anti Rubio radio set up with Mike Gallaghger. And, I read where Rush said Cruz stopped the Gang of Eight bill, and if it weren’t for Cruz we’d have amnesty. So,a planned conservative attack on Rubio.
3. Next, earlier today, I posted a Trump interview on a Texas radio show. Trump said that he and Ted were basically the same on all issues, and then, he said he had HEARD that Cruz was going to call for deportation.
4. Now, Cruz advances a new comprehensive immigration plan, something that was obviously not hastily crafted over the last couple of days, that even proposes the “wall”.
We’ll see how Donald reacts, but my sense is that the whole Carson/Rubio/ new immigration plan was all orchestrated by Cruz in coordination with Trump.
I think their camps are actively acing in concert. What’s your view?
“...no one believes Cruz could actually win in a general election against a country that is half socialist....”
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That’s the same thing the GOPe said about Reagan in 1979 & 1980. They were wrong about Reagan and those who say that now about Cruz are wrong...and wrong for the same reasons.
We’ll see how Donald reacts, but my sense is that the whole Carson/Rubio/ new immigration plan was all orchestrated by Cruz in coordination with Trump.
I think their camps are actively acting in concert. What’s your view?
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Well even if they are not sitting around the table coordinating things, they clearly have common objectives. When the time comes for the convention, Cruz delegates could comfortably vote for Trump if needed, and Trump delegates could comfortably vote for Cruz.
Vin, you are no block head, is what I think! :D)
I have been waiting for the word “deport” to come from the lips of Ted Cruz. That word spells s-e-r-i-o-u-s about ILLEGAL immigration.
That’s the word, along with “the wall”, that has given TRUMP the bump of the field that he enjoys today, because he has made people a believer that he is coming straight at the Democrats and the GOP, and the TPP crowd.
It is TRUMP who has already successfully established that he is just the force to bring a real and a noisy reckoning against the UniParty subjugation to the “fundamental transformation” of our country, what it means and the deadly consequences of it.
If Cruz can latch on to that style of Trump’s Hell on wheels, winner-takes-all difference making, then your point is well taken.
The real hurdle is if TRUMP causes a reset of the field that does include Cruz (unless the Turtle Head crowd causes him a set back) then eventually they will have to battle against the remainders.
If and when it comes to a final two or three, I would guess that Trump will have to remind everyone who owns whom, and will bring up his own self funding, as a contrast against Cruz’ Wall Street donors, who curiously back a conservative, like Cruz.
TRUMP knows these guys who are backing Cruz. So, why are they backing Cruz? What is to be gained for them by backing someone like him— a conservative? I have not heard an opinion on that, and would like to.
Trump may jab Cruz about blowing past Session’s sage counsel, on the vote to move TPP forward. Trump could possibly have some fun with that blooper, since he has also made a polling fortune on calling people “stupid”, gullible and “can’t make a deal”. lol.
I’ve said too much. Are they in cahoots? I’m going to say “no”. They intend to fight for the brass ring to the end, and hope perhaps that the other one is still standing enough to later join the ticket, maybe.
For now, they have no real split on the issues, so far, but for that “deport” word.
Thanks, Vin.
I just don’t think outside of California then, that you had a so thoroughly Marxist educated population, nor anywhere near a match for today’s election machine, ground game, and with electronic media, that galvanizes radical socialists to get out the vote and fight for their hand outs.
Today is entrenched warfare, and it seems to me that Trump is the only one willing to get down into the trenches and come straight at the Democrat/Marxists and the GOP who enable them, willing to play that game out in the street.
The rest of our field are still playing by Marques of Queensbury Rules.
A veto would embarrass Obama, not Cruz.
Most likely the embarrassment will be owned by the Senate Dems who will “filibuster” it to protect Obama as they always do. And any who are up for election next year, they’ll try to count out the votes so those ones can vote for it. The ‘rat party protects their own.
Cruz has come straight at the Democrats/Marxists and the GOP who enable them.
Trump comes at anyone who stands in the way of himself getting elected.
Point taken. That’s the way it’s done, alright, IF you’re a FORCE. I think Trump pretty much is all that. .)
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