Posted on 06/26/2015 1:29:13 PM PDT by SJackson
Not really intended to restart the FR Lincoln or war debate, yes, slavery was an issue, but the idea that the war entered into to end slavery is simply incorrect. If we can bash Jefferson and Washington for slavery, Lincoln deserves credit too. In initiating the war, he had the opportunity to establish slavery as the issue he didn't
Since I understand the issue of erasing Robert E. Lee from history, he freed his slaves in 1862, what do we do with Grant, who freed his personal slave a few years earlier, but not those he managed for his father in law until 1865. His wife too.
This was the lead of his address
...but the idea that the war entered into to end slavery is simply incorrect.The idea that the war *wasn't* about slavery from its very beginning in South Carolina is simply incorrect. Secession and the war was about slavery in the south, as can be seen in the Ordinances of Secession and the secessionist op-eds.
Ping
Interestingly enough, he said this to Congress on January 12, 1848.
“... Any people anywhere, being inclined and having the power, have the right to rise up and shake off the existing government, and form a new one that suits them better. This is a most valuable, a most sacred right—a right which, we hope and believe, is to liberate the world...”
You do know, I assume, that of the 13 Articles of Secession for the 13 states that had them (though only 11 actually seceded), only four even mentioned slavery? They were: Mississippi; Texas; Georgia; and South Carolina.
I hate to have to post the following:
“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races - that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.”
-Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois, September 18, 1858 (The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume III, pp. 145-146.) To be absolutely fair - and I want to be fair - we are going to have to have a national dialog about the future of the Lincoln Memorial.
If you’re suggesting there was disagreement between the legality of slavery between SC and Lincoln you’re mistaken. Had SC not seceded, irrespective of motivation, there would have been no attemt to interfere with slavery in SC or any other slave state. if Lincoln is to be believed, a victory at First Manassas by the North would have been irrelevant to the institution.
Yup, statues have to go. I believe late in the war he was in favor of deportation, none of this 40 acres and a mule stuff
Melt down all your pennies!
Send all your $5 bills to me!
I think that as the war dragged on, and Lincoln became more familiar with the performance of black troops in the Union cause, he became more optimistic about their ability to be citizens. I don’t know if he ever went so far as to believe them equal, but I think he believed them deserving of equal rights.
“As I would not be a slave so I would not be a master. This expresses my view of democracy, whatever differs from this, the the extent of the difference is no democracy.” -Abe Lincoln.
If you’re referring to Lincoln then no - he didn’t believe in deportation. He did briefly study voluntary emigration however.
Like the Founders before him Lincoln believed in the natural right to rise up in rebellion against a tyrannical government. That wasn’t the situation in 1860.
You’re correct. I should have said he saw removal as a/the solution. I don’t think there was any forward looking thought given to it.
I don’t recall if Robert E. Lee was a member of the American Colonization Society (ACS) but I do recall that he paid out of pocket for the emigration of a bunch of former slaves to Africa (Liberia I believe).
Don’t know, Lincoln was interested in their plans though. Lincoln looking to Henry Clay’s solutions. Odd how paths cross.
As the War dragged on the Confederate States congress authorized freedom for any slave that would fight for the South - but that doesn't matter to those wanting to purge American history.
No, Lincoln was by anyone’s definition a white supremacist and he must be brought down regardless. Not quite yet. But the purge of Washington, Jefferson, and eventually Lincoln is coming.
And the star spangled banner that flew over slavery in the war of 1812, and during the native American genocide, and the landing of segregated U. S. troops at Normandy, and the imperialist invasion of Vietnam - all bad, all the time. I think even the Reverend Jeremiah Wright would agree to this narrative. Everything must go but the rainbow flag and president Obama.
Yea, in 1865.
No, Lincoln was by anyone’s definition a white supremacist and he must be brought down regardless
Only by America haters.
“I will say then that I am not, nor ever have been in favor of bringing about in anyway the social and political equality of the white and black races - that I am not nor ever have been in favor of making voters or jurors of negroes, nor of qualifying them to hold office, nor to intermarry with white people; and I will say in addition to this that there is a physical difference between the white and black races which I believe will forever forbid the two races living together on terms of social and political equality. And inasmuch as they cannot so live, while they do remain together there must be the position of superior and inferior, and I as much as any other man am in favor of having the superior position assigned to the white race. I say upon this occasion I do not perceive that because the white man is to have the superior position the negro should be denied everything.”
-Fourth Debate with Stephen A. Douglas at Charleston, Illinois, September 18, 1858 (The Collected Works of Abraham Lincoln edited by Roy P. Basler, Volume III, pp. 145-146.) To be absolutely fair - and I want to be fair - we are going to have to have a national dialog about the future of the Lincoln Memorial.
So what? You think you’ve found some secret never before seen document? Here’s a clue: EVERYONE has seen that.
Again, so what?
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