Posted on 08/14/2013 5:45:12 AM PDT by Perdogg
The foregoing powers include the rule of naturalization and to do that you need to know who does and doesn’t need to be naturalized. Ted Cruz did not need to be naturalized.
He was born a US citizen. Yes, he is a natural born according to the way “natural born” was used in the Naturalization Act of 1790.
Show me the naturalization papers, Ray.
My money is on a congressional resolution being passed for Senator Cruz just like they were for Senator Mc Cain and Obama. That will shut down any action by Congress and the courts are loathe to interfere with the will of the electorate. If Senator Cruz runs, wins the nomination and is elected, he’ll be good to go.
H. Res. 593
In the House of Representatives, U. S.,
July 27, 2009.
Whereas August 21, 2009, marks the 50th Anniversary of President Dwight D. Eisenhower’s signing of Proclamation 3309, which admitted Hawaii into the Union in compliance with the Hawaii Admission Act, enacted by the United States Congress on March 18, 1959;
Whereas Hawaii is ‘a place like no other, with a people like no other’ and bridges the mainland United States to the Asia-Pacific region;
Whereas the 44th President of the United States, Barack Obama, was born in Hawaii on August 4, 1961;
[excerpt]
http://www.govtrack.us/congress/bills/111/hres593/text#
The resolution passed on a vote of 378-0.
Cruz acquired citizenship by operation of law. The law states “citizen”. The law does not state “natural born citizen”.
The Naturalization Act of 1790 was repealed in 1795, more than two centuries ago.
No sane person can make sense to Mama; she lives in a world all her own. I am not a constitutional lawyer but I am a person who obeys the laws of this land and have taken an oath to support the Constitution – several times. I have absolutely no respect for the usurper occupying the Oval Office (rather, the one always on vacation or on the golf course). I call him a usurper not because of the NBC clause of the Constitution but because I don’t believe he was born in Hawaii and his mother wouldn’t have qualified giving birth to Obummer in Kenya due to her age. Obama’s actions since obtaining office have been treasonous to say the least.
To the point of this discussion: Your arguments are right on the money. It is well established and “settled” law that a natural born citizen is one who is physically born in the United States – even to alien parents as long as they are subject to one important restriction: the jurisdiction of the United States – which is what birthers fail to grasp. This reservation of jurisdiction is narrow, and has been generally found to exclude four classes: (a) Indians belonging to tribal nations; (b) persons born to foreign diplomats and heads of state having diplomatic immunity; (c) persons born on American territory to members of occupying forces; and (d) persons born on foreign public vessels within United States territorial waters.
Folks like TexasMama, DiogenesLamp, ASA Vet and many others insist that you must have two citizen parents in order to be NBC. This misconceived notion flies in the face of our Constitution and established precedent. Not that you need my acknowledgment but when you say there are two types of citizens you are absolutely correct – those born here and those who need to be naturalized; THAT’S IT! Of necessity, those born here MUST be NBC if the parents are subject to U.S. jurisdiction; in other words, can be locked up if they break the law.
Only an idiot would add a two-parent citizen requirement atop this. I think they get confused because if one is NOT born on U.S. soil, they do need at least one qualifying citizen parent to be deemed NBC.
Mama and her ilk are in the miniscule minority in this country and totally unsupported by our founding fathers and any legal precedent to this date; certainly the opposite is true! Claiming they are right and totally disrespecting opposing opinion doesn’t make them right – they just prove themselves to be uncivilized bullies. What they did to Jeff Wilson on this thread is disgusting. If this were RedState.Com – another true conservative website – their opinion regarding this matter would be forbidden because of the derisive nature of such opinion.
Staytrue also makes very good points by the way. I might also point out that naturalized citizens take an oath to support the Constitution, which NBC’s don’t have to do unless they serve this country in some capacity so I wonder if maybe we should have an amendment to completely rule out NBC requirement in its entirety and allow naturalized citizens the same rights as the rest of us.
A Certificate of Naturalization applies to those who are 18 or older at the time of their acquisition of citizenship.
I agree. The issues of law that were real against Obama were:
1. His mother’s residency in the US for the required number of years after age 14 (or 16 depending on the law she was under)
2. Whether Obama’s citizenship was renounced in Indonesia.
3. Some dispute over the location of his birth, whether actually in Hawaii or not, but the citizenship residency of his mother at #1 is the real issue in that discussion.
None of those apply to Cruz.
Cruz was born a citizen.
Believe as you wish.
And the law of 1790 shows that “natural born citizen” was a term that was in use for children born overseas.
The law of 1795 superseded the law of 1790, so 1790 was repealed.
The law was repealed - why do you seek to apply it?
I really don’t follow/understand your argument. I take it that the Founders did indeed define/declare citizenship for naturalized citizens such as my mother, no problem here. Naturalized is not the same as ‘natural born’ which is the requirement for POTUSA. Further, am I correct in reading into your opinion that Congress by the words ‘To make all laws which shall be necessary and proper for carrying into execution etc,etc....’ has the right/authority to revise/undo the written Constitution any time It feels like assuming such authority?
Nope, a certificate of citizenship applies to those over 18 but acquired citizenship at birth. Read below and the normal reader will realize that anyone GRANTED citizenship needs naturalization papers. Show me Cruz’s naturalization papers.
A Consular Report of Birth Abroad of a U.S. citizen is only issued to a child who acquired U.S. citizenship at birth and who is generally under the age of 18 at the time of the application. This is RECOGNITION of citizenship at birth and NOT a granting of citizenship.
Essentially, a CRBA is the equivalent of a US birth certificate. The birth certificate is the proof of citizenship used in the US.
From the Citizenship and Immigration website:
Proof of U.S. Citizenship and Identification When Applying for a Job
Your U.S. passport is your best proof of U.S. citizenship. Other official documents can be used, as described below.
Are you a citizen born in the United States?
Your birth certificate provides proof of citizenship. If you need a copy of your birth certificate, contact the Bureau of Vital Statistics in the State in which you were born. We do not issue any kind of citizenship document to a person who is a citizen by birth in the United States.
Are you a citizen born outside of the United States?
The citizenship of someone born outside of the United States, as the child of a U.S. citizen parent, could vary depending on the law in effect when the birth took place. In most cases citizens born outside the U.S. require a combination of evidence showing at least one parent being a U.S. citizen when the child was born and having lived in the United States or its possessions for a period of time.
To apply for recognition of citizenship, you have options:
Your Consular Report of Birth Abroad, or FS-240, provides proof of citizenship if your birth was registered at the nearest U.S. consulate when you were born. For more information you can link to the U.S. Department of State Web site from the “Related Links” section in the upper right corner of this page.
If you are already in the United States, apply for a Certificate of Citizenship. Use Form N-600, Application for Certificate of Citizenship, also available from the “Related Links” section in the upper right corner of this page.
Are you a naturalized citizen or derivative citizen?
You can use your original Naturalization Certificate or Certificate of Citizenship as proof of citizenship. If you have lost either of your certificates, you can apply for a replacement using Form N-565. The instructions to N-565 explain how to file and the process in greater detail. You can access both the form and instructions from the “Related Links” section in the upper right corner of this page. If you do not have Web access at home or work, check with your public library, or you can order a form by telephone by calling the USCIS forms request line at 1-800-870-3676.
Identification when applying for a job
Every employer in the United States must verify that each newly hired employee can be legally employed in the United States. A U.S. citizen may show a variety of evidence to meet this requirement:
U.S. passport;
U.S. birth certificate along with a government-issued photo identification document.
The grant of citizenship is the law.
The LAW states “citizen”.
xzins and P-Marlowe state “natural born citizen”
The law is what matters.
There are sometimes problems with my writing, but the fact is that this is an easy question. There are only two types of citizens: (1) the kind that were born citizens, and (2) the kind that had to be naturalized by the naturalization process.
Cruz is a born US citizen. He was not naturalized. He has no naturalization papers.
The congress has the authority by the Constitution itself to make all laws necessary to fulfill their constitutionally granted powers. To make a rule about who NEEDED to be naturalized, they also had to have a law about who didn’t need to be naturalized.
They said that the children born to US parents overseas were natural born citizens UNLESS the father had never resided in the US. With that rule they established that one parent (the father, at that time) could pass his citizenship to his child EVEN IF the mother was not a citizen.
And they used “natural born citizen” to describe that child.
So, through the years Congress changed that law now and again, and at the time of Cruz’s birth, one parent who met the residency requiremnts could pass their US citizenship to their child.
Cruz’s mother passed her citizenship down to her son, Ted, who was, therefore, an automatic citizen on birth. (A natural born citizen.)
He was NOT naturalized. Otherwise, there would be naturalization papers, and he was not issued any naturalization papers. Unless someone can come forward and show his naturalization papers.
Actually it says citizen at birth. And it says that their citizenship is RECOGNIZED. It doesn’t say it is granted.
In other words, it says that their citizenship is recognized as already being there at birth
Me:
“A Certificate of Naturalization applies to those who are 18 or older at the time of their acquisition of citizenship.”
You:
“Nope, a certificate of citizenship applies to those over 18 but acquired citizenship at birth.”
Why do you say “nope” when you agree?
Actually it says they are born citizens. And it says that their citizenship is RECOGNIZED. It doesn’t say it is granted.
In other words, it says that their citizenship is recognized as already being there at birth
This is apparently a tough concept for some folks.
Because it’s not a certificate of naturalization. It’s a certificate of CITIZENSHIP. In other words, they are recognizing the citizenship that person had by virtue of birth.
IOW, a born citizen. (Which those scoundrels, the Founders, called “natural born citizen” in the law of 1790)
You are spittin’ into the wind, Ray. Give it up or show Cruz’s naturalization papers.
A Certificate of Citizenship recognizes citizenship acquired by operation of law.
1) A person born outside the United States to a US citzen parent may acquire US citizenship at birth. The rules for acquisition of citizenship vary depending on the law in effect at the time the child was born, on the marital status of the parents, and on other factors such as various residency requirements for the US citizen parent.
2) A child may derive citizenship upon the naturalization of their parent(s). The rules for deriviative citizenship vary depending on the law in effect at the time.
3) A person 18 or more years old may be eligible to apply for citizenship via a naturalization process.
Persons who acquire citzenship by either 1 or 2 may apply for a Cerificate of Citizenship.
Person who acquire citizenship by 3 will receive a Cerificate of Naturalization.
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