Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Air France crash: plane may have broken up in mid-air
Telegraph UK ^ | June 3, 2009 | By Henry Samuel in Paris

Posted on 06/03/2009 10:30:55 AM PDT by Oldeconomybuyer

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100101-104 next last
To: AnotherUnixGeek
Have any terrorist groups claimed credit? Terrorism doesn't work if no one knows it was terrorism.

Okay, I'm generally not a tin-foil conspiracy believer, in fact, I consider myself to be a skeptic.

But, this event is really filled with a lot more questions than answers.

My only guess on the lack of a statement regarding a claim of credit is that this event was a test of a new type of explosive or mixture that the terrorists don't want reveal at this time-lest it draw intense scrutiny. It could be a precursor to a much larger event.

61 posted on 06/03/2009 11:25:37 AM PDT by Repealthe17thAmendment (Is this field required?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: r9etb

Flight 587 (Airbus 300) which went down in Queens in 2001 hit wake turbulence from a previous plane and lost it’s vertical stabilizer due to overly aggressive rudder correction by the pilot. The engines then separated prior to crash.

Could be that the control inputs needed in the turbulence they encountered aggravated the problems.


62 posted on 06/03/2009 11:27:09 AM PDT by Tijeras_Slim
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: r9etb
As for me, I could see that sort of spread taking place as a result of the fact that the plane was at 35k feet, in a line of severe thunderstorms. The breakup can be explained by the turbulence reported by the pilots; the spread of debris can be explained by altitude, speed, and stuff getting caught in updrafts. The string of automated failure messages was spread over several minutes, which seems more consistent with an explanation of gradual structural failure.

I wonder if bomb damage, and resulting damage to the plane's aerodynamic characteristics, could have been mistaken for "turbulence" by pilots in a storm as the plane came apart around them.

63 posted on 06/03/2009 11:27:27 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money -- Thatcher)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: kevinm13

Couldn’t have been aliens. It was nowhere near the Bermuda Triangle.


64 posted on 06/03/2009 11:27:41 AM PDT by Fresh Wind (Hey, Obama! Where's my check?)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 58 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer

There is NOTHING to see here move along. No, the 6 muslims arrested with bomb-making equipment were not terrorists. The radiation leak from the nuclear plant is harmless. Muslims do not discriminate against women. Nothing to see here. Move along!


65 posted on 06/03/2009 11:28:00 AM PDT by Doc Savage (SOBAMP!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: r9etb
As for me, I could see that sort of spread taking place as a result of the fact that the plane was at 35k feet, in a line of severe thunderstorms.

Isn't it tru that most modern aircraft have sopisticated enough RADAR that they can avoid nearly all storms?
66 posted on 06/03/2009 11:29:37 AM PDT by tang-soo (Prophecy of the Seventy Weeks - Read Daniel Chapter 9)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 19 | View Replies]

To: y6162
There’s no point in a terrorist blowing up a plane and not taking credit for it.

You assume they didn't take credit for it.

The purpose of terrorism is to control behavior of the target through the use of violence or threat of violence.

What if the French government was quietly told "You just lost a plane. You may be able to keep this quiet. If you do not comply with our demands, you will lose a bunch more planes in a more dramatic manner".

67 posted on 06/03/2009 11:30:53 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money -- Thatcher)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 21 | View Replies]

To: txhurl; roses of sharon
Has anyone heard if any passengers contacted loved ones?

The incident occurred out at sea, far out of cell range.

68 posted on 06/03/2009 11:32:28 AM PDT by PapaBear3625 (The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money -- Thatcher)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 25 | View Replies]

To: Sax
Well worth the read.

Very much, and the comments too. Thanks!

Summary (of a comment? and extrapolated): the tail section (empennage) may have broken off due to turbulence, leading to near-instantaneous decompression, and the resulting g-forces would have kept the pilots from doing anything in the few seconds of consciousness left.

69 posted on 06/03/2009 11:35:21 AM PDT by sionnsar (IranAzadi|5yst3m 0wn3d-it's N0t Y0ur5:SONY|"AlsoSprachTelethustra"-NonValueAdded|Lk21:36|FireTheLiar)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 44 | View Replies]

To: r9etb

I thought Pulkovo 612 was pilot error; they went over the service ceiling for the Tu-154 at that weight, got slow, stalled it and entered a flat spin they couldn’t get out of. They were, however, being beaten around by a severe thunderstorm at the time and trying to get over or out of it.

}:-)4


70 posted on 06/03/2009 11:35:27 AM PDT by Moose4 (Hey RNC. Don't move toward the middle. MOVE THE MIDDLE TOWARD YOU.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: dalereed

Why then do you suppose this Air France plan flew into a thunderstorm if all pilots know to avoid them?


71 posted on 06/03/2009 11:37:46 AM PDT by Churchillspirit
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 60 | View Replies]

To: tang-soo

There’s an airline pilot forum linked off another FR thread on AF447 today...on there, pilots were saying that the particular type of thunderstorm spawned in the area where AF447 was flying is very hard to spot on radar for some reason, much harder than the storms we get in the US. Something about if you’re pointing the radar straight ahead, you might not get a return, but if you tilt it down toward the bottom of the clouds, they show up better.

}:-)4


72 posted on 06/03/2009 11:38:17 AM PDT by Moose4 (Hey RNC. Don't move toward the middle. MOVE THE MIDDLE TOWARD YOU.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 66 | View Replies]

To: Robe
Although you only have less then a min (usually 30 sec)to get oxygen before passing out, you are well aware of blowing all the snot out of your head (Sorry to be so graphic , but that's the truth

LOL, I've wondered what it would feel like. I'm certain it would be nothing like the airline safety videos.

(The funniest was on EgyptAir -- the mask falls down in front of a middle-eastern man and bobs, and his head tracks it for three bobs before reaching for the mask.)

73 posted on 06/03/2009 11:39:00 AM PDT by sionnsar (IranAzadi|5yst3m 0wn3d-it's N0t Y0ur5:SONY|"AlsoSprachTelethustra"-NonValueAdded|Lk21:36|FireTheLiar)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: roses of sharon
Well, of course a cell would not work....but a Sat phone would

I don't remember seeing seatback satphones in the A330s. Entertainment centers, yes.

74 posted on 06/03/2009 11:40:59 AM PDT by sionnsar (IranAzadi|5yst3m 0wn3d-it's N0t Y0ur5:SONY|"AlsoSprachTelethustra"-NonValueAdded|Lk21:36|FireTheLiar)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: clamper1797
The automated short circuit message may well have been a result of another problem rather than any kind of a direct cause of a major problem.

HF

75 posted on 06/03/2009 11:41:40 AM PDT by holden
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: tang-soo
Isn't it tru that most modern aircraft have sopisticated enough RADAR that they can avoid nearly all storms?

According to this discussion the plane did not avoid the storms, but in fact flew through a storm cell. In his discussion on turbulence, the author states, "Young updrafts are particularly dangerous to flights because they contain significant rising motion yet precipitation fields have not yet fully developed and airborne radar signatures are weak, reducing the likelihood the crew will deviate around the cell."

76 posted on 06/03/2009 11:44:10 AM PDT by r9etb
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 66 | View Replies]

To: AnotherUnixGeek

“Terrorism doesn’t work if no one knows it was terrorism.”

That’s not necessarily so ... this situation (so far)leaves everyone not knowing but many suspecting, and that creates another kind of terror.

Absent black boxes or other means of knowing what really happened, I would hope the passengers’ and crew’s backgrounds and associations will be looked into very carefully.


77 posted on 06/03/2009 11:48:22 AM PDT by EDINVA (A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend on the support of Paul -- G. B. Shaw)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 18 | View Replies]

To: Oldeconomybuyer

The guy in the story is giving a line of BS -or- he’s just repeating what he heard someone else say...having trained in high-altitude chambers I can tell you that although one would fall unconscious rather quickly (most folks within 15-30 seconds) you do not instantly fall unconscious between 30,000 - 40,000 ft. Unless the high speed aerodynamic stresses got to them first they almost certainly knew what happened...if only for a short period of time.


78 posted on 06/03/2009 11:51:21 AM PDT by g_gunter
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: All
Brazilian Air Force Photo of Oil Slick


79 posted on 06/03/2009 12:12:19 PM PDT by VaBthang4 (Too many FReepers whine too damn much. Your kneejerk contrarianism is not Conservative.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 78 | View Replies]

To: Churchillspirit

Probably a french pilot!!!

the planes are equiped with wearther radar for that exact purpose, avoid thunderstorms.

The wind sheer in a thunderstorm can be over 200mph in oposite directions.

I went through a very tiny embeded one and it turned the plane upside down, it ain’t fun!


80 posted on 06/03/2009 12:17:48 PM PDT by dalereed
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 71 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-20 ... 41-6061-8081-100101-104 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson