Culture of conspiracy: The Birthers (mainstream decides to cover)

Politico ^ | 3-1-09 | Ben Smith

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

I don’t see any request in there that would take more than 5 minutes to collect and copy.

Could you provide a certified copy of "all documents and/or records... including, but not limited to his birth certificate, social security verification, college transcripts, background checks, investigation reports, citizenship verifications, secret clearance, passport records and any other documents not mentioned herein bearing his name"?

They're asking for every single piece of paper with his name on it.

[Michael Michael]

Is it? What legislation changed the clause you posted to read what I posted?

The qualification was changed from five years after the age of fourteen to two years after the age of fourteen in 1986.

If you have a library near you with a decent reference section, you can go look it all up in Statutes at Large.

I'll defer to the Supreme Courts interpretation of the Constitution over yours.

Yes, God forbid you should ever think for yourself.

So I presume that prior to Brown v. Board, you'd have argued the side held in Plessy v. Ferguson?

I mean, if you're not going to think for yourself, and abdicate all thinking with regard to the Constitution to the Supreme Court, I don't see how you could have done otherwise.

Unless, of course, you can point to where the Constitution defines natural born or where it says only persons born or naturalized in the United States are citizens of the United States.

Citizenship clause of the Fourteenth Amendment:

All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside.

Senator Jacob Howard, author of the citizenship clause of the Fourteenth Amendment, upon his proposing the amendment (the citizenship clause was added as an amendment to the proposed Fourteenth amendment) in the Senate:

It settles the great question of citizenship and removes all doubt as to what persons are or are not citizens of the United States.

The Fourteenth Amendment offers only two means by which one can be a citizen of the United States. By being born IN the United States, or by way of naturalization.

There is simply no means under our Constitution for anyone born OUTSIDE the United States to be a citizen of the United States except by way of some form of naturalization. And if the natural born citizen clause says nothing else, it says that naturalized citizens cannot hold the office of President.

Congress cannot amend the Constitution by way of simple legislation.

[Michael Michael]

They're asking for every single piece of paper with his name on it.

Piece of cake! We'll have that for you in five minutes!

[Velveeta]

As Mr. Snarky pointed out above, Berg was asking the DNC for whatever they had in their (the DNC’s) files.

Someone at the DNC is the keeper of records. They could pull all this information in a heartbeat.

And yes, I can get you my SS card, birth certificate, background check, transcripts, diplomas, passport, tax returns, W2s, all utility bills, mortgage info, bank statements, marriage certificate, childrens’ birth certificates, childrens’ passports, car titles, immunization records, and whatever you want in less than 5 minutes. 10 steps into my office, turn right and open the bottom file drawer on the right. It’s all there.

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

As Mr. Snarky pointed out above, Berg was asking the DNC for whatever they had in their (the DNC’s) files.

Obama was listed as well.

Someone at the DNC is the keeper of records. They could pull all this information in a heartbeat.

Really? You think the DNC is the keeper of Obama's school transcripts?

Oh, and "certified" means notarized at the very least. You providing xerox copies of the stuff in your file drawer doesn't constitute a certified copy in the legal sense.

[Michael Michael]

Obama was listed as well.

And what fish bait here keeps ignoring is the very crux of the argument, i.e. that there was a motion to dismiss pending for lack of standing. Why should anyone have to hand over anything if there's a chance that the case would end up being tossed before it ever got started?

Also, we've come a long way from what was the original issue. That being this bit from the Israel Insider article:

The Obama team contented itself with a motion to dismiss the case and a protective order, but there has yet to be a ruling on this, perhaps to the surprise and chagrin of Obama and the DNC. Obama's lawyers in these motions, argued that revealing the information (birth certificate, citizenship in other countries, etc.) would “cause a defined and serious injury” to Obama and/or the DNC. They say revealing these documents raises a “legitimate privacy concern” and the above mentioned risk that “particularly serious embarrassment will result from turning over the requested documentation.” The source of that embarrassment was not specified.

Not one of those quotes appears in the motion to dismiss or in the motion for the protective order. Someone simply made them up and dishonestly tried to pass them off as claims made in the two motions.

In other words, they lied.

It appears some people don't mind being lied to as long as whomever is lying to them tells them lies they want to be true.

[Velveeta]

You don’t think Obama could get his hands on his transcripts (if he doesn’t have them in his file already) with one quick phone call?

OK, add another 10 minutes to my paperwork gathering to include copying and notarizing. My notary is 1/2 mile away.

So, in 15 minutes, I can get copies of whatever you want notarized. Add another 20 minutes if you want me to stop at the post office to overnight them anywhere. The post office is notoriously slow around here.

But if I had something that I REALLY didn’t want you to see, I’d lock my doors - hire 3 law firms and have them fight on my behalf for months and years on end.

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

It appears some people don't mind being lied to as long as whomever is lying to them tells them lies they want to be true.

It also appears that some people don't mind lying if it drives people to donate to their cause via their Paypal accounts.

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

Then by all means, lets see all those documents. What are you hiding?

[Velveeta]

“Fish bait” gave me the heartiest chuckle of the day. LOL

At least now I know you do have a sense of humor, sense of humor, Mr. Snarky Michael Michael.

But I digress.

II. Discussion
Rule 26(c)(1) authorizes the Court to enter a protective order to protect a party “from annoyance, embarrassment, oppression, or undue burden or expense,” including an order forbidding the discovery or specifying terms for discovery.

That’s from the protective order. Obama begging please, please don’t make them make me turn over the documents
because the results will be embarrassing!

[Velveeta]

Huh? I didn’t get that Bubba.
I don’t have a paypal account.

[Velveeta]

“What are you hiding?”

Thanks for admitting that Obama’s hiding the documents.

I’m not hiding anything. But gee, I guess because I am not POTUS.

Which documents would like to see? Please provide your name, address and phone. If you want the docs notarized, you can pick up the tab for that.

Overnight mail or snail mail?

[Michael Michael]

It also appears that some people don't mind lying if it drives people to donate to their cause via their Paypal accounts.

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

I don’t have a paypal account.

But Berg does. And Taitz does. And Hale does. And Donofrio does.

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

Obama begging please, please don’t make them make me turn over the documents because the results will be embarrassing!

Or because Berg is just annoying. Don't forget annoying.

[Michael Michael]

“Fish bait” gave me the heartiest chuckle of the day. LOL

Glad you enjoyed it. That's always been the first thing that comes to my mind whenever I see "Velveeta."

II. Discussion Rule 26(c)(1) authorizes the Court to enter a protective order to protect a party “from annoyance, embarrassment, oppression, or undue burden or expense,” including an order forbidding the discovery or specifying terms for discovery.

That’s from the protective order. Obama begging please, please don’t make them make me turn over the documents because the results will be embarrassing!

No, that's simply quoting from 26(c)(1). The only word actually used with regard to any sort of argument was "burdensome." You're free to disagree with the burdensome argument, but you can't deny the fact that embarrassment was NEVER given as an argument, contrary to the false claims made in the Israel Insider article.

You're just weaseling around trying to defend a blatant lie.

[Michael Michael]

But Berg does. And Taitz does. And Hale does. And Donofrio does.

Yeah, but it's Taitz who's been getting all the attention of late. Donofrio's pretty much pitched in the towel, don't really keep up with Hale, and Berg's basically been in a holding pattern for months and I don't think he has more than just a few hangers on.

[Velveeta]

Not weaseling around at all.
Just calling it as I see it.

[Michael Michael]

Not weaseling around at all.
Just calling it as I see it.

Then may I recommend...

[Velveeta]