Posted on 08/11/2007 10:08:38 PM PDT by KerryOnNoMore
“Why should homosexuality be considered a greater sin than lying, cheating, having affairs, etc.”
Because it is. God doesn’t lie.
Get your bigetry and rudeness out in the open, coward.
This man did NOT BELONG TO THAT CHURCH!! He belonged to NO Church..it said so in the story.
Thank you so much for your encouragements, dear brother in Christ!
but a sad conglomeration of dysfunctional accomplices in abomination
= = =
Too true.
But it is ALSO a community with it’s own norms, cohesiveness, goals, boundaries (such as they are and aren’t) . . . etc.
And it is still CHRISTIAN and GOD EXPECTED OF US to Love the sinner without loving the sin;
hold them compassionately and kick them pointedly with the truth all at the same time.
Few authentic Christians seem up to the task, sadly. And masses of them rush along toward hell accordingly . . . needlessly.
And the Christians nearby smugly walk on by sanctimoniously proud that they don’t have THAT HORRID sin on their score card. While God MAY be considering their smug pride as WORSE.
So what's your point? Jesus had no home and depended upon the charity of others. Did Jesus have a synagogue which he called home? Nowhere in the Bible is such a thing stated or implied. In fact, the synagogue in his hometown tried to kill him.
Christians established orphanages and leprosy colonies for people who had no home. Not all of those people became Christians. Mother Teresa established a facility in India for those who had no home. Not all of those people became Christians. Churches, pastors, and missionaries commonly give funeral or graveside services for the homeless and they have no idea whether the person was a Christian.
If this man had not been gay, you would have had no problem with the church having a funeral for him. God said that all of us are sinners. Why do you think your sins merit forgiveness while that man's sins don't?
My wife ministered for years at Mardi Gras to people involved in very horrendous sins. Instead of shouting "God hates fags!" like some church groups were doing, she talked with them and told them how they could find peace and joy in Jesus Christ. People came to Christ because of her work. I've ministered to people involved in the occult, people involved in drugs, illegal aliens, as well as to gays and to AIDS patients. They didn't contaminate me. In God's eyes, my sins were no better than their sins.
God save the Church from people from holier-than-thou people like you. You should be bringing people into the Church -- even people whose sins you find particularly repulsive -- rather than driving them away from the Church.
Jesus said that he came to the sinners of the world. All of us should do likewise.
What a horrible post. You should be ashamed of yourself. Being homosexual is a terrible sin and I have never, ever implied otherwise. I even said in an earlier post that reaching out to those who are gay -- they call themselves the "gay community" and I'm going to stick with term -- should not mean that we compromise our values. My wife has ministered to prostitutes and brought some to know Christ. Should my wife have called them whores instead of prostitutes?
What separates you from me is that I want to bring these people to Christ. There but for the grace of God go I. For some reason, as far as I can glean from your posts, you hate them so much that you don't care whether they come to know Christ or not. Jesus loved you while you were still a sinner; why should you not afford other sinners the same courtesy?
Good grief....you can’t be married or buried at any old church that you want. No different than Jewish people can’t go to Temple on High Holidays without BELONGING or buying a TICKET.
Because it is. God doesn’t lie.
True, some sins are worse than others. But even one sin will send us to hell.
You know, I've always disliked being labeled a "homophobe" because I do not support the homosexual lifestyle. However, you really do seem to be a homophobe. Why can't you just love them into knowing Christ instead of rejecting them? My friend who died of AIDS became a Christian only because his sister, his niece, and I did not reject him, but loved him. If we hadn't done that, he would be in hell right now. All we did was follow the example of Jesus.
It's just possible that in God's eyes that you've committed worse sins than homosexuality. God said that liars have no part in his kingdom in the same passage where he said the same thing about sexual immorality. Have you ever told a lie? If so, congratulations, because God has put you in the same class as homosexuals.
I don't doubt your salvation but I definitely think that you are very immature in the faith. It's time for you to become a grown-up Christian.
You might be surprised to find out that there are plenty of pastors, missionaries, and churches who give services and a burial plot to the homeless. They care about people regardless of their sins. You don't.
Of COURSE they do that for homeless....was this guy HOMELESS????
It is in Gods view.
Besides, the memorial is for the living—his or her family.
Including the gay lover. The church, ANY church, should not be forced to condone that. They should not be forced to memoralise a lifestyle that's a sin. The church is for sinners to repent, not glorify their sin.
Having a service that includes a gay lover would denote acceptance of that life. It's against everything the Bible says. And no church should be forced by emotional blackmail into sacrificing their beliefs whether those beliefs are PC or not.
Consider this: you grow old and enter a rest home. The church you belonged to loses membership and closes its doors. Do you think that you would deserve a funeral in another church or that your body be dumped in a cemetery with no church service at all?
I'm sorry, but you're not making a lot of sense. Take a look at yourself. Do you show the love of Christ for sinners in your daily life? Or do you only deign to mingle with folks who sit on the front pew of your church? If your church has outreach street and event ministries, does it consist of people shouting "God hate fags!" and "Heavy metal music lovers are doomed to hell!" If your church is engaged in reaching out to the the unsaved no matter how unsavory the unsaved are (and from your post, I doubt that it does), does it do so out of love or out of legalism?
Where do you get the idea that we're not supposed to judge other Christians because of their actions? The Bible tells us to do so!
The apostle Paul confronted a case of gross moral failure in the Corinthian congregation that included “immorality of . . . a kind that does not occur even among pagans” (1 Cor. 5:1). Yes, we are to judge other Christians by their actions.
Paul also wrote, "What business is it of mine to judge those outside the church? Are you not to judge those inside? God will judge those outside.(1 Cor. 5:13).
As Paul says, it's God's business -- not our business -- to judge those outside the church. Our job is to bring sinners inside the church and to tell them "go and sin no more." You're not doing what the scriptures plainly tell us to do.
Not only is their a distinct lack of love and mercy amongst many of you, but there is terrible lack of Biblical knowledge. Read Matthew 8:15-17 for an example of how Jesus says we are to judge others in the church.
You don't know the last moments of that man's spiritual life. I think that we should show mercy and assume the best. The very worst thing that could happen would be that the man's friends, relatives, and "partner" might hear the gospel that could bring them deliverance. Is that so bad?You think that we should assume the worst and show judgment to someone presumed to be outside the church, regardless of what Paul wrote to the Corinthians. How many people missed hearing the Gospel because of that church's actions? Do you even care?
This is for you, SuzyQ, dsc, and others: if my friend had encountered you guys before he died instead of his sister, his niece, and me, he would be in hell right now instead of heaven. Are there any people in your past that you had the chance to minister to but refused to do so because you deemed their sin to be too bad?
No, it does not. When my friend died, his former "partner" and other friends attended the service. They heard the Gospel -- many of them for the first time. They were told that God could bring them the peace and joy that they do not have -- again, many for the first time. The church did not "endorse" the lifestyle but rather shared the love of Jesus. I can only judge you by what you say, but apparently you think that some people do not deserve to hear the gospel.
A good friend of mine used to smuggle drugs and illegal aliens inside the United States from Mexico. He stole, robbed, drank, fought, used drugs, and committed just about any sin you can think of. Fortunately for him, some of his friends had mercy on him, shared Christ with him, and he is now a model husband and father and a deacon in the church.
In fact, my wife and I visited his church once (it's a Spanish-speaking church) and the lady we met when we came in asked us whether it was the pastor or "Brother Miguel" who invited us. Of course, it was "mi hermano in Cristo, Miguel." She knew who it was in the church that most reached out to bring others to Christ. That's what can happen when people hear the gospel.
I would even go so far as to say that excluding known sinners from a service where the gospel is preached is a sin. Slam me if you want to but I would rather meet God and have him show me the times that I shared the gospel with sinners than to show me the times where I refused to share the gospel because I thought that someone was unworthy.
Yes it does. But your judging is discriminatory. There's no evidence that this man repented. There was NO way to celebrate his life without including his sin. Yet you tell others not to judge him while you judge them. Not cool.
You don't know the last moments of that man's spiritual life.
No. I don't. What was there to celebrate? Or to praise? Repentance? Again, there's no proof.
The church is for those who want to change their life. They find their way to our door. We go OUT to witness Gods love to the rest. Don't forget that Jesus fashioned a whip and drove the moneylenders from His Fathers house. Did he witness to them first? Sin doesn't belong in Gods house. Neither does turning a blind eye to it.
Your friend had repented. That is VERY different than an unrepented gay.
Slam me if you want to
Seems to me that you're slamming others in your perfection. All I've read is what YOU'RE doing and not what Christ is doing through you.
but I would rather meet God and have him show me the times that I shared the gospel with sinners than to show me the times where I refused to share the gospel because I thought that someone was unworthy.
None have refused to share the Word. They have refused to defile Gods house.
I’m glad I don’t belong to that church. You know, everyone commits sins—maybe they shouldn’t have any memorials. And the church should be a place that sinners can come, I actually think that’s what churches are for.
Explain to me why Christ fashioned a whip and drove the moneylenders from His Fathers house. Is it because they were sinning and UNREPENTANT?
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