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Good News on FairTax
Town Hall . Com ^ | 4/13/06 | Herman Cain

Posted on 04/14/2006 2:42:07 PM PDT by Eaglewatcher

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To: pigdog
Only one thing wrong - you're almost totally incorrect about the breadth of things on the black market a(and how long they'll operate from outside of a jail cell). And don't kid yourself about the states ... when their tax revenues are hugely involved and with more money to pursue evildoers (and a smaller base of crooks to choose from while having even more tools to work with) the state will be quite effective. And most states presenly have even less revenue at stake.]

So, you have the other poster claiming: "the fact is enforcement mechanisms would be at the individual state level and there is no mechanism for them to abuse individual taxpayers under the fairtax much less destroy them."

You, on the other hand, claim that the states will be "quite effective" policing every tax-free transaction that every American can potentially carry out with every other American with cash, a wink and a nod.

You will have as much luck shutting down the black market as the Prohibition-era U.S. Government had keeping America alcohol-free.

The only way to put the black market in "a jail cell" would be to create a police state that would make the Soviet Union seem like a Libertarian Party convention.

381 posted on 04/16/2006 7:24:07 PM PDT by Polybius
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To: Polybius

Where do you think such a "vast" black market will sp[ring up from ... and how do you claim they'll stay out of jail for long enough to seel all their stuff???

Guess you really haven't read the bill.

The Chicken Little approach won't hack it and Nightie (or several others who've tried it) could tell you.

There will be no vast black market springing up or even a half-vast one.

Presently, however, there already is the equivalent truly huge body of tax evaders in the illegal economy composed of illegal aliens, drug dealers and others. They contribute basically nothing in the way of tax revenue now but will when they spend their now-illegal income for taxable things at retail under the FairTax. The dollar size of this evasion is far greater than any sort of black marklet that could ever be devised under the FairTax.


382 posted on 04/16/2006 7:26:42 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: Principled
It is not established that the prebate redistributes.

False. You buy no taxable items, you receive the "prebate" regardless.

lol

Forced and unconvincing, tinged with desperation.

383 posted on 04/16/2006 7:29:00 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: pigdog
The point is that you're not required to take wither the prebate

You're not forced to take foodstamps either. And it's a much smaller entitlement scheme than the "prebate."

384 posted on 04/16/2006 7:30:41 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: RobFromGa

Oh, I see - you try to pretend that such indexation can only increase and not decrease???? AAn interesting reading of the law. Could you point out where it says that?

The rate claculated each year is not "to give the Guv the money they need" at all but to distribute entitlement funds in the same proportion they not are distributed presently.


385 posted on 04/16/2006 7:34:39 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: Mojave
You buy no taxable items, you receive the "prebate" regardless.

As has been shown time and time again...

irrespective of income, people find money to spend. The data show.

Which of these groups will spend below the poverty level? (You'll need to click the link).

Who is desperate? THe one who posts data and uses the data to support assertion or the one who ignores the data and name-calls?

386 posted on 04/16/2006 7:36:34 PM PDT by Principled
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To: RobFromGa

You arrogantly assume that everyone has such a simple tax situation. In fact, I recently has a 23 page tax return filed (all pages were required) and my accountant charged "somewhat" more the your paltry $500.

The point really is that the tax showing on those forms is not at all the complete amount of tax you pay as you've been told many times.


387 posted on 04/16/2006 7:39:03 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: Principled
As has been shown time and time again...

Showing your butt doesn't count.

irrespective of income, people find money to spend.

First, you're begging the question; second, not all spending is taxable.

Care to try for a strike three?

388 posted on 04/16/2006 7:40:30 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: pigdog

It doesn't include employee payroll taxes


389 posted on 04/16/2006 7:40:30 PM PDT by Principled
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To: Your Nightmare

Are you trying a lame attempt at the old pissing up a barn door contest against grandpa's barn to see who makes the highest mark?

I stopped that before you were born.


390 posted on 04/16/2006 7:42:06 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: Mojave
You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make him drink.

The link shows that it doesn't matter WHAT is reported for income, poverty level spending is achieved.

That means there is no overpayment of refund.

Click the link, it won't overwhelm you - it's just one page.

391 posted on 04/16/2006 7:42:54 PM PDT by Principled
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To: dmw

Yes, he is a fool. I firsst encountered him back about '98 or so on the Tax Reform threads and I have yet to find anything useful he has contributed to the discussions.

You're right.


392 posted on 04/16/2006 7:44:15 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: William Terrell

Yes ... there is no "socialist orientation" in the FairTax, but only in your greatly distorted view of it.


393 posted on 04/16/2006 7:46:07 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: pigdog

He has that nice apple on his posts. Too bad the posts are devoid of information.


394 posted on 04/16/2006 7:46:11 PM PDT by Principled
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To: Mojave

ftp://ftp.bls.gov/pub/special.requests/ce/standard/2001/income.txt


395 posted on 04/16/2006 7:47:13 PM PDT by Principled
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To: William Terrell

And if it turns out substantially better as most economists think it will and you benefit greatly from it - ane you willing to donate all the hundreds and thousands of dollars (or more probably) to the "Pigdog Pacification Charity" that I'll found??

You surely wouldn't want to profit from something you're morally opposed to. (Would you???)


396 posted on 04/16/2006 7:49:22 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: Principled
The link shows that it doesn't matter WHAT is reported for income, poverty level spending is achieved.

False. Any individual signed up on the "prebate" dole can pay less than the entitlement check in taxes. And not all purchases are taxable.

You're spitting teeth while pretending victory.

397 posted on 04/16/2006 7:50:15 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Mojave

Naw - go read what Marx actually said. His hot button was the income tax.


398 posted on 04/16/2006 7:50:42 PM PDT by pigdog
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To: pigdog

Redistribution of income and entitlements. Marx and Boortz.


399 posted on 04/16/2006 7:52:50 PM PDT by Mojave
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To: Polybius

And YOU - having not read the bill and knowing next to nothing about it do not understand that with the FairTax the taxpayer has no "bumping into" the state (or federal) tax authority. They interact with the busineses who collect the tax, not the taxpayer. And they have ample legal ammunition to detect and shut down the sorts of black markets you think will be vast. They won't even be half-vast and most will wish they hac=d complied with the law since they are not paying the tax anyway - their customers are.

I frankly doubt many would be so foolish as to not charge me sales tax (taking on this liability themselves) in order to save me the sales tax. They'd rishk their entire business and even go to jail to help me out??? Whaddaguy!!!!


400 posted on 04/16/2006 7:57:56 PM PDT by pigdog
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