Revote today [Dover, PA school board]

York Daily Record [Penna] ^ | 03 January 2006 | TOM JOYCE

[Dimensio]

It is hemorrhaging because it cannot answer simple questions posed by Intelligent Design.
rather thoroughly answered. It may be true that some people don't like the answers, but given that an answer has been offered, they should at least attempt to explain where they find fault.

[Dimensio]

Argh. My post was malformed because of bad HTML.

It is hemorrhaging because it cannot answer simple questions posed by Intelligent Design.

What questions? The only "question" I've seen is "how can 'irreducably complex' structures evolve without intelligent intervention", and that question has been rather thoroughly answered. It may be true that some people don't like the answers, but given that an answer has been offered, they should at least attempt to explain where they find fault.

[JamesP81]

Simple solution to the whole mess: no more public schools. Period. Then I wouldn't have my children indoctrinated with ideas I disagree with, whether those ideas are that evolution is a proven fact or the appalling things coming out of sex education classes they teach now.

And after they graduate public school, send 'em to a private college.

[mlc9852]

"Is it in our country's interest to keep kids ignorant?"

Can you explain how telling students that there may be intelligent design is keeping kids ignorant? No one proposed eliminating the teaching of the TOE. You are going a little overboard.

[highball]

If someone's parents believed that gravity only went up 3 miles, or that four times five equalled thirty, or that molecules didn't exist, would education be trampling on their rights?

In the meantime, China and India keep cranking out more scientists, engineers and mathematicians. Is it in our country's interest to keep kids ignorant?

You make some excellent points, and illustrate precisely why this fight is so important. Scientific ignorance is harmful to the future of our nation.

[peyton randolph]

If ID is taught, then I insist they teach kids the alternative 'theory' of how the flying spaghetti monster designed everything.

[Dimensio]

Can you explain how telling students that there may be intelligent design is keeping kids ignorant?

Telling children that intelligent design is science is lying.

[peyton randolph]

Can you explain how telling students that there may be intelligent design is keeping kids ignorant?

Well, it was a 'theory' that leeches were a medical cure for what ailed George Washington et al. Shall we insist that leeches be used in med school the same way as an alternative 'theory?' After all, it was good enough for the Father of Our Country.

[jennyp]

The court made it perfectly clear: the school system has a duty to prevent children from adhering to their parents' beliefs.

Talk about spin! The decision reiterated that public schools are no place to promote any particular religious beliefs. If the parents don't like it, they always have the option of private school.

Or even, like, discussing what they believe, and why, with their children over dinner.

[MineralMan]

"Shall we insist that leeches be used in med school the same way as an alternative 'theory?' After all, it was good enough for the Father of Our Country."

Funny you should mention leeches. They ARE used in medicine today. Not to "bleed" patients, as they were with George Washington, but to promote blood flow when severed extremities, like fingers, etc., are reattached.

They work very well at this job.

[BenLurkin]

You know, you'd have a better argument if you insisted that Hindu creation belief be taught. It would lend some credibility to your argument to compare one deep rooted belief system with another.

Problem is. . . the good folks of Dover aren't Hindus. Turns out they may not be Christians either -- but either way they should have a greater say in what their kids are taught.

I mean . . . we are conservatives here, right?

[peyton randolph]

Not to "bleed" patients, as they were with George Washington

Which I compared to ID.

but to promote blood flow

Which I am aware of...and it is comparable to evolution in this example, that is, it is based on scientific theory as opposed to a faith-based belief.

[Dimensio]

Turns out they may not be Christians either

How did you deduce this?

[BenLurkin]

"Whether a student accepts the Board’s invitation to explore Pandas, and reads a creationist text, or follows the Board’s other suggestion and discusses “Origins of Life” with family members, that objective student can reasonably infer that the District’s favored view is a religious one, and that the District is accordingly sponsoring a form of religion. Second, by directing students to their families to learn about the “Origins of Life,” the paragraph performs the exact same function as did the Freiler disclaimer: It “reminds school children that they can rightly maintain beliefs taught by their parents on the subject of the origin of life,” thereby stifling the critical thinking that the class’s study of evolutionary theory might otherwise prompt, to protect a religious view from what the Board considers to be a threat."

[MineralMan]

"Or even, like, discussing what they believe, and why, with their children over dinner."

---

No! Not That! Sheesh...you mean that families should speak to each other while eating food? I've never heard of such a thing. Get this started, and pretty soon you'll have families discussing things even when they're not having meals. We can't have that!

Mealtime is to be conducted with a pair of bored parents who rarely speak to each other, along with any of their offspring who aren't at a friend's house, on a date, anorexic, or terminally bored.

Said offspring must sit at the table with incredibly bored expressions and pick at their food, heaving great sighs of dissatisfaction before leaving the table to watch porn or work on their MySpace blog on their computer while eating nacho cheese chips out of the bag.

The very idea that discourse should happen while eating has been thoroughly debunked. It is a thing of the past, and must be discarded, along with all other relics of family life from those days.

[mlc9852]

So the students can't make up their own minds?

[mlc9852]

Did the leeches work?