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ABC-TV DISCOVERS “POPE JOAN”
Catholic League ^ | December 29, 2005 | Bill Donohue

Posted on 12/29/2005 11:45:43 AM PST by NYer

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To: Jaded
File it under 'Jeez, Not This ***t Again'. I'll be at a quilt shop spending money.

21 posted on 12/29/2005 12:02:24 PM PST by Bratch
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To: Phantom Lord
(1) Your claim of nepotism is highly exagerrated. It existed, certainly, but was not "extreme".

(2) The early history of the Papacy, from Peter to St. Gregory the Great, is incredibly awe-inspiring. The world's first system of leadership based on goodness, not military power.

(3) No Pope ever "held orgies" - that's a myth spread by uneducated idiots with an agenda. There isn't the slightest shred of evidence to support such a charge.

22 posted on 12/29/2005 12:08:41 PM PST by wideawake
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To: wideawake

It is well known that John XII threw wild sex parties.


23 posted on 12/29/2005 12:09:39 PM PST by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: NYer

Little Joan was not feelin' well...

She was afraid she might go to hell...

But she never gave up hope...

even when she became the Pope..

Said hey Joan, take a walk on the wild side.


24 posted on 12/29/2005 12:09:57 PM PST by Blzbba ("Shop Smart. Shop S-Mart" - Ashe, Housewares)
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To: Red Badger

>> It's an "Urban" myth...........<<

Funny you should mention that... I think Pope Urban was the real Pope. :^D


25 posted on 12/29/2005 12:11:33 PM PST by dangus
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Comment #26 Removed by Moderator

To: wideawake
John XII also basically turned the Lateran Palace into a brothel.

Sometimes history isn't pretty.

27 posted on 12/29/2005 12:13:26 PM PST by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: no_turnipseed

You are likely more correct in pegging the time frame. But I would say the fist 700 years of a 2000 year religion could be considered "early".


28 posted on 12/29/2005 12:14:27 PM PST by Phantom Lord (Fall on to your knees for the Phantom Lord)
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To: Phantom Lord
John XII was accused by his enemies of having sexual affairs with three different women at various times before and during his reign.

He definitely had an affair with one woman - the widow of one of his political rivals from his secular career, and this affair almost certainly continued during his Papacy.

He also supposedly played at dice and hunted and completely neglected his duties in favor of politicking.

In other words, he behaved exactly like a typical petty nobleman of his day, instead of taking his responsibilities seriously.

But not even his most dogged enemies accused him of holding orgies.

29 posted on 12/29/2005 12:14:43 PM PST by wideawake
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To: Phantom Lord
John XII also basically turned the Lateran Palace into a brothel.

No, he did not. His enemies referred to the Lateran as a brothel because he brought his mistress there - an absolutely disgusting display - but no one seriously claimed that actual prostitutes were plying their trade in the Lateran.

30 posted on 12/29/2005 12:16:33 PM PST by wideawake
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To: Phantom Lord
Sometimes history isn't pretty.

The actual facts of John XII life are extremely ugly - he was an immoral, irreligious slob.

There's no need to invent unattested tales of orgies and brothels.

31 posted on 12/29/2005 12:18:01 PM PST by wideawake
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To: NYer

Debunked here:

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/08407a.htm

Scroll down to "fiction 4", here:
http://www.love2learn.net/religion/samples/popefict.htm

I would suggest people complain:
http://abcnews.go.com/Primetime/story?id=131877&page=1


32 posted on 12/29/2005 12:18:33 PM PST by bnelson44 (Proud parent of a tanker! (Charlie Mike, son))
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Comment #33 Removed by Moderator

To: NYer

Actually I remember Paul Harvey telling this story when I was young.
There are segments of the old bible that are not allowed
because they refer to this incident.
I grew up believing this for 50 years.
may or may not be true but what an impression it made
in me.


34 posted on 12/29/2005 12:30:04 PM PST by squibs
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To: Phantom Lord
It is well known that John XII threw wild sex parties.

Gosh, I didn't know that! How did I miss it in my studies of history, it being so well known and all?

35 posted on 12/29/2005 12:32:46 PM PST by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all that needs to be done needs to be done by the government.)
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On Thursday evening, instead of watching Sawyer's revisionist garbage, read the work of a fellow freeper.


36 posted on 12/29/2005 12:33:46 PM PST by A.A. Cunningham
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To: no_turnipseed; Phantom Lord
The true ugly periods of the Papacy were really the 10th century and the 15th century.

In the 10th century the city of Rome fell under the control of a few powerful families who ruled the city like Mafiosi since the political order of Europe was chaotic and there were no external checks on these gangster families.

They used their power to coerce the clergy of Rome to elect their sympathizers to the Papacy.

John XII was one of these Popes.

Benedict VII tried to break the hold these families had over the Papacy and insituted some strong reforms in 981. In 999, Frenchman Gerbert D'Aurillac - the well-known scholar - came to Rome to set matters in order and the Cluniac reformers followed in his wake.

John XII was a sickening anomaly, not a typical Pope even for his time.

37 posted on 12/29/2005 12:39:11 PM PST by wideawake
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To: NYer
From what I've read about medieval life, hiding your gender for years would have been pretty much impossible.

Their privies had no absolutely no privacy back then. Bathroom habits for most people were pretty public. It wouldn't take too long before someone would noticed. I guess this fact eludes the MSM.

38 posted on 12/29/2005 12:41:22 PM PST by lizma
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To: wideawake

"But not even his most dogged enemies accused him of holding orgies."


From wikipedia:

"Much that is alleged about the pornocracy comes from the histories of Liutprand, bishop of Cremona. Liutprand took part in the Assembly of Bishops which deposed Pope John XII and was a political enemy of Rome; he is described by the Catholic Encyclopedia as "ever a strong partisan and frequently unfair towards his adversaries." The worst excesses of the time might be considered no more than ecclesiastic gossip."


39 posted on 12/29/2005 12:42:34 PM PST by Blzbba ("Shop Smart. Shop S-Mart" - Ashe, Housewares)
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Comment #40 Removed by Moderator


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