Posted on 07/15/2005 11:29:25 AM PDT by nypokerface
Wait a minute. Is it your contention that The Messiah was a Roman Catholic?
You just said as much.
"Can someone explain why they are viewed as different (is it just the praying to Mary- there must be something more) and why it was such a big thing that prior to JFK there was not a Catholic POTUS?
I'm missing the thing that caused this agency and countless individuals to discriminate against Catholics."
I can explain it, but the short version is so curt that it ends up being hurtful, like the poster who implied Catholics aren't Christians.
And the long version is rooted in history and very boring.
I am only willing to give the long version, by the end of which you'll either understand or be sound asleep.
But I'm not going to do it unless you ask again.
We're talking paragraphs here.
Paragraphs and paragraphs.
There's 2000 years of history to pull apart.
Let me put it in the Jewish context: are Ethiopian tribesmen who keep kosher and who think of themselves as Jews because of ancient links really Jews?
Ok, while you're puzzling that one out, how about Karaites. Were Karaites Jews?
How about Samaritans, with the Samaritan Pentateuch. Were they Jews?
How about the Jewish followers of Jesus in the First Century. Were Peter and Paul and the Apostles still Jews?
Today's "Jews For Jesus"...are they Jews?
Finally, the Ultra-Orthodox, Orthodox, Conservatives, Reform, and utra-Reform...are they all Jews, or is there a line somewhere that one crosses and ceases to be a Jew?
Is an atheist, secular Jew a Jew?
Your answer to those questions will actually take you a long, long, long way down the road of understanding the kinship and animosity between other branches of Christianity and the Catholics.
If you want the long version, ask.
Some important context left out there:
19 Now when it was late that same day, the first of the week, and the doors were shut, where the disciples were gathered together, for fear of the Jews, Jesus came and stood in the midst, and said to them: Peace be to you.
20 And when he had said this, he shewed them his hands and his side. The disciples therefore were glad, when they saw the Lord.
21 He said therefore to them again: Peace be to you. As the Father hath sent me, I also send you.
22 When he had said this, he breathed on them; and he said to them: Receive ye the Holy Ghost.
23 Whose sins you shall forgive, they are forgiven them; and whose sins you shall retain, they are retained.
Thanks, but I'll let the Jews determine what is and is not Jewish Scripture.
You pose very interesting and complex questions.
Since I was born Jewish, and married a Catholic, and am relatively open-minded about religion and the NT and OT, I'm ready for your long version, at your convenience.
Neither do Catholics.
Yeah, your only point my a$$ you bigoted, anti-Catholic SOB. You specifically spelled out Catholics and three non-Christian faiths. Now you're trying to squirm out of it you gutless sheet-covered newbie.
Slither back to wherever you came from.
PS .... I think you erred on your screen name, didn't you mean jw666?
Do you exclude that possibility? It's a serious question.
Heugenout ping at post 463.
Nah, I think he's just someone who stuck his foot in his mouth and is now trying to get it out.
Holy Mary, mother of God, pray for us sinners...
It is a subtle distinction, but it is a distinction. Very often misunderstood.
Let me ask you, as an "outsider looking in": Do Jews of Ashkenazi lineage and those of Sephardic lineage have as little respect for one another as Christians have shown one another on this thread? What about Reformed v. Chasidic, or others?
This thread is making my stomach turn. A fine bunch of God's children we are.
Heck, by jw777's "logic," Baptists, Methodists, Lutherans, Presbyterians, Anglicans and all the others aren't Christians, since they don't use the word in their title, either.
Congratulations, jw777. If that's the only criteria, you've found the One True Faith - Mormons! ;)
The Lords Prayer is one of the prayers that make up the Rosary.
Context? He's reminding not only His apostles, but everyone that He came here to teach. What is written is intended for all. Perhaps you'd also like to argue context and the Holy Spirit also, would only come to priests? Just as the Sign of Jonah would be given to all, so to were the commands and prayer as I gave them above. The key is, "as the Father hath sent Me, I also send you." He is sending them to teach , as He taught them.
Matt 11:25-At that time Jesus said, "I praise you, Father, Lord of heaven and earth, because you have hidden these things from the wise and learned, and revealed them to little children. Yes, Father, for this was your good pleasure.
"All things have been committed to me by my Father. No one knows the Son except the Father, and no one knows the Father except the Son and those to whom the Son chooses to reveal him.
"Come to me, all you who are weary and burdened, and I will give you rest. Take my yoke upon you and learn from me, for I am gentle and humble in heart, and you will find rest for your souls. For my yoke is easy and my burden is light."
Luke Luke 11:33 "No one lights a lamp and puts it in a place where it will be hidden, or under a bowl. Instead he puts it on its stand, so that those who come in may see the light.
What He asked and taught in the room, was the same light He gave everywhere else. They just happened to be in the room 'cause other folks were out to kill 'em.
< Do Jews of Ashkenazi lineage and those of Sephardic lineage have as little respect for one another as Christians have shown one another on this thread? What about Reformed v. Chasidic, or others?>
Hasidic/Orthodox Jews do not view "Americanized" Jews as Jewish
(unless they are looking for a tenth man for a minyan ;)
I was raised Conservative, which is traditional, middle of the road, and the Cons looked at the Reforms as not as religious, (organ music in a synagogue??!! Oy!)
LOL, but it's sad.
The Sephs and Ashk's have their own conflicts, but I believe they generally acknowledge each other as Jews.
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