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Oldest Fossil Protein Sequenced [from Neanderthal]
Max Planck Society ^ | 08 March 2005 | Staff

Posted on 03/15/2005 7:20:27 AM PST by PatrickHenry

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To: Verginius Rufus
(the current year is 5765)

How do Jewish scholars notate events which occurred before their 0 year?

61 posted on 03/15/2005 11:05:54 AM PST by ASA Vet (Pobodys Nerfect)
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To: PatrickHenry
This sequence difference is at position nine, where the crystalline amino acid hydroxyproline is replaced by proline (an amino acid that is found in many proteins).

Interesting because hydroxyproline is seldom found in proteins other than collagen. In that osteocalcin is a bone protein, and bone and connective tissue are intimately interconnected, I wonder if there are any sequence homologies.

62 posted on 03/15/2005 11:11:10 AM PST by facedown (Armed in the Heartland)
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To: clearsight

> is no way there were that many critters to make that much oil

ERRRR. Remember, we're talking about time frames of *hundreds* of millions of years.

> the researcher makes a good point that those critters had to be a lot deeper than where the actual oil is found in order to even be converted to petroleum

That's nice. And those critters *were* deeper than the oil currently is.

> Mt St Helen's for instance; Coal is already forming under the debri fields and at surprisingly shallow depths.

Compare that arguement to the one you just made above: "need to be deep =/ can be real shallow." One of them is wrong, as coal can be converted to oil relatively easily, geologically speaking.

> Nasa was shocked when they only discovered at the max an average of 1/4" of lunar dust.

No, they weren't.

> The known natural rate of pressure depletion (loss) in unreleased gas fields flys in the face of the old earth theory.

Except, of course, for the little problem that oil/natural gas production is an ongoing process.


63 posted on 03/15/2005 11:13:06 AM PST by orionblamblam
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To: clearsight
There is just to much conflicting science out there to accept that the earth is millions and millions of years old.

The science is NOT conflicting. The science is supporting. What is conflicting is YEC who wish to twist certain scientific explanations of facts (theories) to ensure they get to keep their literal reading of Genesis in tact.

Back to Petrochemicals; The known natural rate of pressure depletion (loss) in unreleased gas fields flys in the face of the old earth theory. The gas pressures are currently to high to support old earth theory, suggesting a much younger earth.

Please provide ALL of your scientific articles and links published by reputable scientific magazines.

64 posted on 03/15/2005 11:18:23 AM PST by hawkaw
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To: orionblamblam
Simply read my posts and do an Internet search on the names of the researchers. One can read between the lines of their findings that they do not accept the 10's of millions of year old earth theory. 6,000 years ???? eh....ok....10 to 15 thousand and then I might grant you 20 thousand, but no more.........It is known that the earth's magnetic field is weakening by half every 1400 years. It is also know that the magnetic field is absolutely required to be at certain levels to support life (promote healthy cell interaction/duplication) at all. If it is to great nothing can live. If it gets to weak things begin to mutate and die. This is only one reason why humans will never survive on planets with weak magnetic fields e.g. the moon, mars or planets with very very strong magnetic fields. It has to be just right.....
65 posted on 03/15/2005 11:18:32 AM PST by clearsight
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To: clearsight

> It is known that the earth's magnetic field is weakening by half every 1400 years.

Never saw a sine wave, huh? Never saw fluctuations in the stock market, waves on the ocean, noticed the cycles of sunspots? Up-and-down is normal, and often reverses itself on a regualr basis.

> It is also know that the magnetic field is absolutely required to be at certain levels to support life (promote healthy cell interaction/duplication) at all.

Wrong.

> If it is to great nothing can live.

The magnetic field from the monitor in front of you is likely several times stronger than the Earths magnetic field. Critters, humans included, regularly live in magnetic fields *far* more powerful than the Earth's. Frogs have been levitated by magnetic fields with no ill effects.

> If it gets to weak things begin to mutate and die

Everythign dies. And mutation is, on the whole, a good thing as it drives evolution.

> This is only one reason why humans will never survive on planets with weak magnetic fields e.g. the moon, mars or planets with very very strong magnetic fields. It has to be just right.....

I'm sorry, but that's just damned funny. I've been studying manned spaceflight and space colonization for two decades, and never have I seen such silliness. Magnetic fields in and of themselves do not effect organic systems much at all. Go to the hardware store, buy the strongest magnet you can buy and hold it in your hand or tape it to a mouse. The field will do nothing.


66 posted on 03/15/2005 11:25:18 AM PST by orionblamblam
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To: orionblamblam

Except make some people rich selling magnets.


67 posted on 03/15/2005 11:28:28 AM PST by js1138
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To: orionblamblam
I do believe we have one to add to the list that includes 1720 and the earth revolving around Saturn.
68 posted on 03/15/2005 11:30:12 AM PST by js1138
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To: orionblamblam
Oh you accept that it is an on going process??????
Which process the buried animal/forest one, or the deep high pressure, heat, mineral combination one down at the mantle ??? Oh by the way who is supplying all the dead rotting material today if oil and gas are forming from buried animal/debris ?? Don't animals and plant life decompose more quickly than in 1000 years ???? Seems like we would have run out of that supply by now except that maybe there was another Noah's flood or meteor impact that we missed somewhere along the way that cause more debris to be buried ??????
69 posted on 03/15/2005 11:31:45 AM PST by clearsight
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To: js1138
If only more people would listen to *these* guys...


70 posted on 03/15/2005 11:31:50 AM PST by orionblamblam
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To: StJacques

Starting around post 49, we have some petroleum-geology posts you may find interesting.


71 posted on 03/15/2005 11:33:29 AM PST by PatrickHenry (<-- Click on my name. The List-O-Links for evolution threads is at my freeper homepage.)
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To: clearsight

All stages in the formation of oil/coal are ongoing. This is hardly surprising. It not like sedimentation, vulcanism, decay and the like suddenly stopped a million years ago...

> Don't animals and plant life decompose more quickly than in 1000 years ????

Not always. Look up "bog people."


72 posted on 03/15/2005 11:34:16 AM PST by orionblamblam
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To: VadeRetro
"...Humans still have the pseudogene remnant of their former ability to synthesize vitamin C. Hello? ...The scenario runs something like this.... "

But you still don't have evidence of humans without the ability to synthesize the protein, so you don't have any evidence of evolution.

A more likely scenario is that human's originally was originally designed with both the ability to synthesize vitamin C as well as the ability to generate this protein whether or not they had vitamin C.

Humans, primates and guinea pigs all lost the ability of synthesize vitamin C but still have the pseudogene.

We know that the body often can compensate for the loss of some functionality. For examine, a loss of a kidney or eye, or a gall bladder, or an appendix and still function although at a suboptimal level. Thus an original design that included vitamin C sysnthesis as well as the ability to generate protein in the absence of vitamin C would be consistent with the redundancy that we often find designed in the human body.

73 posted on 03/15/2005 11:34:52 AM PST by DannyTN
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To: PatrickHenry

Not to mention magnets.


74 posted on 03/15/2005 11:35:41 AM PST by js1138
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To: clearsight
Ah. I think I've figured out where you get your science knowledge, especially about planetary magnetic fields:



75 posted on 03/15/2005 11:37:49 AM PST by orionblamblam
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To: clearsight; orionblamblam
Here's an abstract by Dr. Kenney.
76 posted on 03/15/2005 11:42:55 AM PST by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: <1/1,000,000th%

The abstract shows itself to be rather lame within the first few sentences:

"It is p ointed out here how all such predictions have depended fundamentally upon an archaic hypothesis from the 18th century that petroleum somehow (miraculously) evolved from biological detritus..."

Miraculous? Tell these peopel about "miracles:"
http://www.changingworldtech.com/information_center/press_releases.asp?id=19

They use technology that replicates the geological processes that made oil, to turn "biological detritus"... into oil. Ain't no miracle, ain't magic... it's just a technological application of a natural process.


77 posted on 03/15/2005 11:47:25 AM PST by orionblamblam
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To: orionblamblam
The abstract shows itself to be rather lame within the first few sentences:...

At least it's not edited. It's the author's own work.

78 posted on 03/15/2005 11:49:42 AM PST by <1/1,000,000th%
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To: DennisR
So you are saying that vitamin C did not exist at that time? And if you are saying this, how do you know it did not exist? Just curious.

I interpreted that to mean that vitamin C was less common in the diet available to Neanderthals, not non existent.

79 posted on 03/15/2005 11:53:43 AM PST by JimRed ("Hey, hey, Teddy K., how many girls did you drown today?")
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To: DannyTN
But you still don't have evidence of humans without the ability to synthesize the protein, so you don't have any evidence of evolution.

Cluelessly vague-sounding non sequitur. One whole limb of the primate tree with omnivore dietary habits has a unique osteocalcin. This is not the only fact in the universe. There's a bigger picture.

Humans and chimps also have the same cytochrome C molecule, something we share with no other species. Humans and chimps also have the same cytochrome C gene save for one silent mutation. And there's that pseudogene thing which would have us still synthesizing vitamin C had it not been stomped on by some ancient mutation. There's the mutational drift in the pseudogene since it became a pseudogene. There's retrotransposon evidence that humans and chimps have common ancestry not shared with any other species.

But, of course, you don't know anything at all of the big picture. You wave every tiny piece of it away whenever and wherever presented. "Mountain? What mountain?" All you know of the 29+ Evidences when you see it linked is that that means it's time to link Ashby Camp's made-to-be-waved-about-and-not-read rebuttal. You don't really know anything.

You're the poster boy for what ID would turn out if it were taught in our schools.

80 posted on 03/15/2005 11:54:17 AM PST by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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