Posted on 11/15/2004 2:15:17 AM PST by LouAvul
German Ping
There are some German Army prisoners buried at Finn's Point National Cemetery in New Jersey. There were several POW camps in southern New Jersey later in WW2 and some of the prisoners were hired out to work on local farms.
I don't know if it is true but I was told that some of the Finn's Point burials were of anti-Communist Ukranians who were serving in the German Army when captured and that they committed suicide when they learned that they were to be returned to Russia (where they probably would have been tortured and then executed anyway).
"And in death, all soldiers are equal. There is a certain honor in giving up your life for your homeland, no matter which country or which side you fought for, and that honor should be remembered from time to time."
What a pantload of sentimental BS.
The Allied Powers took away a swath of Germany to give to Poland so that Poland would not be landlocked. It made the German city of Danzig into the Polish city of Gdansk.
Germany in 1914:
And with the corridor to the sea slicing through Germany changing Danzig to Gdansk, and cutting off Prussia from Germany itself:
One of the popular slogans that took Germany to war with Poland was "Danzig ist Deutsch!"
We have about 100,000 U.S. Military personnel stationed in Germany. No reason not to have liaison don't you think?
And did you know that there are two German Luftwaffe squadrons of 300 men stationed at Holloman AFB, in New Mexico?
What you say is true of every person who ever lived. All, and I mean ALL, will face judgment. The only hope any of us has is the Grace of Jesus Christ, which is freely extended to ALL men.
If they truly accepted salvation they will be saved, regardless of what uniform they wore.
I don't know what is in anybody's heart - neither does anybody else - but I know that I am responsible for my relationship to Christ, and that pretty much keeps me occupied.
My point in the original post was that it seems unfair to compare men who operated in the discipline of an organized army to cowards who cover their faces when murdering helpless victims and go on cruise ships to throw old men in wheelchairs overboard.
I once met a black American who served in the U. S. Army in WWII as a guard for a POW camp in Louisiana. He told me that the German prisoners were friendly to him, and seemed very happy to be out of the war. There were no escapes, because the camp was surrounded by inhospitable swamps full of alligators.
His attitude toward the Germans was quite positive.
My English and History grades were all A's. My typing class...well, I opted out because even Pass/Fail, I was going to fail.
I did not make that up. He was anti-Jewish...according to a bio I saw on the History Channel.
That may be, but they were taken captive on the battlefield. The issue is not who invaded whom, the original issue was whether or not it is appropriate to honor German POW war dead.
My response remains the same. It is American tradition to honor combatants who serve honorably on the battlefield when they have served their country honorably; regardless of which their country is. It is part of the larger tradition of honor among soldiers that has been handed down for hundreds of years. American soldiers have been taught from the time that they enter basic training that they are expected to fight as long as their enemy does and, as soon as their enemy ceases fighting, they are to stop fighting as well. The object of battle is to force your enemy to capitulate, not humiliate them. And, in death, the same holds true.
Those German POWs may not have been Americans, but they served their country honorably and they belong to the band of soldiers that every soldier belongs to.
Charles Lindbergh flew "The Spirit of St. Louis". I think that was the poster's point. I don't believe he was disputing your premise.
DOH!
"Spirit of St. Louis"...That's what I meant. I am currently on Codine recovering from a root canal. My brain is only firing on four cylinders.
That was Georg Gaertner/Dennis Whiles.
Sorry, no good.
Surely the cause for which one fights must form the foundation for determining the worth of the effort. That the German soldier fought bravely and well is not in doubt. They fought for a regime that practiced mass-murder, enslaved millions, engaged in openly aggressive war and for which I can find no redeeming features at all (even the much vaunted economic recovery under the Nazis was the result solely of Hitler's drive to rebuild and rearm the nation so as to engage in war).
I don't much care if the Germans of today want to "honor" their dead soldiers or not. I simply believe that these men earned no honor because the cause for which they fought was one of the most loathsome in history and any effort to "honor" them is rendered empty for that reason.
The comparison with the Confederacy is very inexact. The south had slavery established a good two centuries before the war. The south did not wage an agressive war of conquest against the north but fought defensively. The south did not engage in genocide as a national policy. Slavery was certainly a blight on the cause but was not the sole reason that most southern men fought. I think U.S. Grant said it right when he said of general Lee(to paraphrase) that "The cause for which he fought was one of the worst for which any man has fought." but that Lee himself was an honorable and noble figure who acquitted himself bravely.
But if you want to honor the men who fought for the Nazis please don't let me stop you.
"....But if you want to honor the men who fought for the Nazis please don't let me stop you."
Your last line ruins an otherwise possibly cogent argument - although not against the point under debate.
Just because someone disagrees with you does not make someone a Nazi sympathizer. Now, have you stopped beating your wife?
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