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Water on Mars? We knew that 30 years ago!
Mariner 9, Viking, NASA | 1971 | NASA mission data

Posted on 03/01/2004 4:20:00 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife

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But still the public is led to believe that an announcement this week will tell us if there is water on Mars. I don't get it.

March 1, 2004 - Mars: A Water World? Evidence Mounts, But Scientists Remain Tight-Lipped***There is no doubt that the Opportunity Mars rover is relaying a mother lode of geological data. Using an array of tools carried by the golf cart-sized robot -- from spectrometers, a rock grinder, cameras and powerful microscopic imager -- scientists are carefully piecing together a compelling historical portrait of a wet and wild world.

Where Opportunity now roves, some scientists here suggest, could have been underneath a huge ocean or lake. But what has truly been uncovered by the robot at Meridiani Planum is under judicious and tight-lipped review.

Those findings and their implications are headed for a major press conference, rumored to occur early next week -- but given unanimity among rover scientists and agreement on how and who should unveil the dramatic findings. Turns out, even on Mars, a political and ego outcrop hangs over science.***

1 posted on 03/01/2004 4:20:01 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: All
Letter to the Editor: Velcro? Tang? Indeed the fact that so few people understand how pervasive and important space technology has become is one of the key challenges in generating support for space exploration. (Larry Miller, To Boldly Go .. . .) The mythology of Velcro and Tang trivializes what has, in fact, been a key engine of innovation and discovery fueling our economy for the past 40 years.

Had I, upon reading Larry Miller's column, suffered a heart attack and fallen to the pavement, I would hope that a passerby would flip open their cellular phone to call for help. If so, they would be using a communication device powered by a monolithic microwave integrated circuit (MMIC) computing chip which came from the space program, and placing their call over cellular and terrestrial networks that depend upon space systems (GPS satellites) for the precision timing necessary to operate. The 911 operator would dispatch an Emergency Medical Services crew, which in many cities would use space-based satellite navigation systems to get to me as quickly as possible.

Once on the scene, the paramedics might get my heart beating again using an automatic external defibrillator whose high-capacity discharge surfaces came from space technology. Once my condition was stable they would hook me up to a blood-oxygen monitor that was developed to fit in the glove of Apollo astronauts, and take my temperature using an infrared "in the ear" device developed from NASA technology. In many instances the paramedics would hook me up to a harness of medical monitoring devices, invented by NASA for the Apollo program, and beam my medical vital signs back to a team of doctors at the hospital. If they worried about me slipping into shock on the ride to the hospital, they might put me in an anti-shock suit, again developed originally by NASA for astronauts.

Back at the hospital (we raced there safely thanks to anti-lock braking technology pioneered by NASA), doctors would probably want to take an image of my heart using a space spin-off technology like a CAT scan or magnetic resonance imaging (MRI). If they found my ticker needed regulating, they might give me an implantable pacemaker--again, a NASA spin-off technology. If things were more serious, they might need to implant a ventricular assist device (VAD), better known as the NASA-Debakey heart pump; invented by NASA engineers and famed heart surgeon Dr. Michael Debakey, the VAD is based upon space shuttle main engine turbo-pump technology and is expected to save some 30,000 lives each year in the United States as it takes its place alongside so many other NASA technologies in our nation's medical centers.

Space technology is absolutely everywhere, ubiquitous, and the technologies developed or derived from human space flight programs are essential to our quality of life and standard of living. Miller's inability to put his finger upon anything more serious than Velcro or Tang highlights one of NASA's biggest challenges in advancing the new space vision articulated by President Bush--the trivialization of the vast technology benefits of space exploration by the arrogant or misinformed, and the poor job that the space agency has historically done of communicating the vast benefit of the NASA enterprise to all of us on Earth.

The United States enjoys a high quality of life and is the technology leader on the planet because of the investments our nation made 40 years ago. The fact that space technology has become so ingrained in our lives that we no longer recognize it when we see it is not necessarily a bad thing. But we do need to consider whether remaining at the leading edge of technology for the next 40 years is important, and perhaps might be worth the paltry less-than-one- percent of the federal budget that we invest in NASA.

--Elliot G. Pulham President and CEO The Space Foundation Weekly Standard

2 posted on 03/01/2004 4:21:13 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
"Water on Mars? We knew that 30 years ago!"

Let's give the inspectors time to do their jobs.

3 posted on 03/01/2004 4:29:15 AM PST by billorites (freepo ergo sum)
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To: billorites
Oh.

Bush's return to the Moon Initiate just might save NASA from NASA.

4 posted on 03/01/2004 4:34:12 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
And the word on UFO's is that it makes the BEST BEER.
5 posted on 03/01/2004 4:38:39 AM PST by samtheman
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To: samtheman
March 1, 2004 - Mars atmosphere has life-killing chemical By Diedtra Henderson The Denver Post [Full Text] An astronomy team led by a Boulder-Colo.-based Space Science Institute researcher has detected hydrogen peroxide for the first time in the martian atmosphere.

Antiseptic and life-killing, the chemical helps explain why the martian atmosphere and surface are void of life.

Finding it could spur attempts to look for other theorized elements -- like nitrogen compounds. And the result, reported in this month's issue of the journal Icarus, could drive decisions to design an instrument to measure hydrogen peroxide during future Mars missions.

Guy Webster, a NASA Jet Propulsion Lab spokesman, said it was unlikely to alter the scientific missions carried out by rovers currently on the red planet.

To detect the chemical, which was long theorized but never before confirmed, researchers had to be in the right place at the right time.

The James Clerk Maxwell Telescope, perched near the 14,000-foot summit of a dormant Hawaiian volcano, is a sleuth that works in a slice of the light spectrum that boldly reveals the fingerprint of even trace amounts of hydrogen peroxide. The team pointed the scope into clear skies at midnight last summer, when Mars and Earth drew closer than they had been since Neanderthals ruled Europe.

The scientific legwork that allowed the astronomy team to peer through Mauna Kea's high, dry atmosphere was Todd Clancy's, the research team leader.

Clancy had worked on the Big Island telescope before. Up to a year before the historic event, he asked for time on the telescope during the Mars opposition.

At that time, Mars was closest to the sun, meaning the planet warmed, said project team member Brad Sandor. Warmth produced more water vapor in the atmosphere. Hydrogen peroxide is produced by the action of sunlight on water.

When past searches for the chemical came up empty, researchers wondered if their atmospheric models were wrong.

So the project could have given new life to the models or helped to undermine their credibility.

"If you're looking under these very best of conditions and with this particular telescope, and you don't see it, you might be able to say more concretely maybe it's not there," said Sandor, a Space Science Institute researcher whose specialty is the atmospheres of Earth, Mars and Venus. Hydrogen peroxide exists in trace amounts in the martian atmosphere -- in doses as low as ozone-eating chlorofluorocarbons on Earth. But the small amount pulls more than its weight.

Acting as a catalyst, it drives the abundance of carbon dioxide and carbon monoxide in the martian atmosphere. Without hydrogen peroxide, molecular oxygen -- now a tiny sliver -- would soar to compose 10 percent of the martian atmosphere. [End]

6 posted on 03/01/2004 4:41:53 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
The two guys on Mars now aren't equipped to analyze the atmosphere? (Just curious. I don't know what would be required to do that kind of analysis by a robot on site.)
7 posted on 03/01/2004 4:53:17 AM PST by samtheman
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
If memory serves there are nano- to micromolar
concentrations of H2O2 in humans, since it is a twoelectron intermediary of metabolism.
That must rule out life here, too. [LOL]


Many -outside of, and derided by, NASA- speculated water on Mars,
for example ['WATER ON THE MOON AND MARS'].

8 posted on 03/01/2004 4:55:01 AM PST by Diogenesis (If you mess with one of us, you mess with all of us)
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To: samtheman
two guys on Mars now

You mean the geologist rover robots?

Never send a rover to do a man's work.

Seriously, robots can do some things man can't or shouldn't, but improvising isn't one of them. It takes a human behind the machine to do that and if the man isn't clever enough, or the machine isn't capable enough, that isn't going to happen either.

Clementine detected water-ice at the Moon's south pole, because the men operating the orbiter improvised a radar experiment on the fly.

9 posted on 03/01/2004 5:01:05 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Diogenesis
It's a good time to use the Moon to develop our capability. By creating processes for mining and using off-planet resources, we will kick-start an Earth-Moon transportation system. Once we are able to use off-planet resources, we will never look back. Space exploration will be wide open.
10 posted on 03/01/2004 5:07:01 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
Instead of wasting our money trying to find out if there is life on Mars, we should be trying to map its resources.
11 posted on 03/01/2004 5:20:27 AM PST by Brilliant
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To: Brilliant
Unfortunately this water thing has everything to do with "the search for life." If ever there was a non-mission. Saganism lives.

If some other life is out there we'll eventually come across it. But making it your mission is crazy! What President Bush has proposed is to get back to the basics and learn how to use the Moon to build a capability and do it within a budget. His initiative sees resources (which includes lunar ice) as things to exploit. It's so clear and direct, it's simplicity is hard for many to grasp.

12 posted on 03/01/2004 5:28:14 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Diogenesis
"If memory serves there are nano- to micromolar concentrations of H2O2 in humans, since it is a twoelectron intermediary of metabolism"

The average concentration in the body may be micromolar, but at specific points and circumstances, it can be far higher. As I understand it, white blood cells actually generate H202 as part of the mechanism by which they kill foreign bacteria.

13 posted on 03/01/2004 5:41:21 AM PST by Wonder Warthog (The Hog of Steel)
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To: Cincinatus' Wife
Glad you wrote that. For a while, I thought I was the only one who thought that way.
14 posted on 03/01/2004 5:52:12 AM PST by Brilliant
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To: Wonder Warthog
Wonder Warthog, you are correct. Cytoplasmic and nuclear superoxide dismutases and catalases
bring those intracellular H2O2 concentrations locally to near zero.
Thus, H2O2 does NOT not rule out life.

Importantly, Cincinatus' Wife accurately points out our major weakness:
Lack of a Earth-Moon taxi.

15 posted on 03/01/2004 5:54:14 AM PST by Diogenesis (If you mess with one of us, you mess with all of us)
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To: Brilliant
You're not alone. Goldin beat back anyone who dared to speak of the Moon. Many left NASA and planetary science because of the Sagan/Goldin/Clinton years, but they're making themselves heard as they see a renewal of exploration sanity.

Goldin was afraid of the Moon because it would slow his Saganized vision of NASA. Sean O'Keefe quickly saw NASA had painted itself into a corner (which Colombia emphasized) and went to President Bush. Now things can change and NASA can be saved to do all the things they have to advertise they do, but in fact haven't been doing.

Of course this is being met with hostility from those who see their projects in jeopardy.

16 posted on 03/01/2004 6:00:24 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife


Ah-Nuld: The whole core of Mahs eees ice! All hwe av to do is staht the reaktor, and there will be enuff hair for everyone to breeeth
17 posted on 03/01/2004 6:22:01 AM PST by BaBaStooey
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To: BaBaStooey
LOL!
18 posted on 03/01/2004 6:32:44 AM PST by Cincinatus' Wife
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To: Cincinatus' Wife; zeugma; xm177e2; XBob; whizzer; wirestripper; whattajoke; vp_cal; VOR78; ...

If you'd like to be on or off this MARS ping list please FRail me

19 posted on 03/01/2004 11:35:02 AM PST by Phil V.
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To: Phil V.
Thanks for the ping!
20 posted on 03/01/2004 11:44:00 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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