'The Passion' & the tar baby

Jerusalem Post ^ | Feb. 28, 2004 | Jonathan Rosenblum

[Enterprise]

"Similarly, the Rabbi complained that the Jews in the film were dressed in dark clothing, which added to the negativity of the Jews portrayed in the film."

Yeah, the women should have carried Gucci Purses and couldn't Punchass Pilate at least have worn a Rolex? I mean, what were the producers thinking anyway?

[Steve_Seattle]

Although I didn't see anything in the film which is contrary to recent pronouncements of the pope, some Protestants might question the historicity of the treatment of Mary, the mother of Jesus. The film treats Mary as having a close, sympathetic relationship with Jesus, whereas in the Bible there are passages indicating estrangement between Jesus and his family, including his mother. The film stops far short of portraying Mary as the quasi-divine "Queen of Heaven" of Catholic devotion, but possibly portrays her as more in sympathy with Jesus' mission than is warranted by the Biblical record. But this is subject to debate . . .

[McGavin999]

I went to see this today, being aware of the feelings of the Jewish community, I looked very carefully at the presentation. I swear by all that is holy there was NO anti-semitism, not a hit of it. There were Jewish people on both sides, those who screamed for death, and those who wept or looked on with horror. The Priests at the temple were on both sides as well.

At the beginning of the film, we are all reminded that Christ CHOSE the sacrifice. The overwhemling lesson of the movie was that of love and forgiveness.

[Steve_Seattle]

"I wish Gibson had not included the non Gospels character of Claudia, Pilate's wife, as a sympathaizer of Christ."

This was not made up by Gibson - it's in the Bible (Matthew 27:19):

"While he [Pilate] was still presiding on the bench, his wife sent him a message: 'Do not interfere in the case of that holy man. I had a dream about him today which has greatly upset me'" Gibson embellished it a little, but the kernel of that story is in the Bible.

But one non-Bilical story he DID introduce was the pro-Jewish legend of Veronica, the woman who wiped the face of Jesus as he stumbled with the cross. According to Medieval legend, the cloth retained the miraculous image of the face of Christ.

[ontos-on]

I saw the film. Concerning Pilate, the film depicts him as having been warned by the Roman Emperor that if there is anymore bloodshed in Judea, the blood would include his. This fits the fact that historically he was removed by the Emperor for being too brutal; but it also corresponds with the gospels' account of Pilate as the reluctant player that is depicted in this film. [It is mere cant for the "scholars" to so linearly dismiss the reluctant Pilate of the gospels simply because he was later removed for brutality. ]

The film portrays Pilate as fearing a popular uprising and fearing one regardless of whether he freed Jesus or crucifies him. This is depicted in the film as the reason why he does the "Lavabo inter innocentes manus meas" ["I will wash my hands among the innocent"] washing his hands of Jesus' blood and fate but nevertheless directs his soldiers to do what "they" want, menaing what is desired by "the Jews" including mostly the high priests--after "they" have just demanded that he be crucified.

It is interesting that scholars report that the gospel writers might have had reasons not to emphasize Pilate's actual role, but I suspect such scholarship of possible revisionism with an agenda to avoid blaming Jews. I grew up in Catholic schools in the 50's and 60's and I never ever heard the Jews blamed for the death of Jesus. My testimony must sound amazing to those who for some reason believe that Catholic schools in the US were foaming with haterd of the Jews, but I never even heard a stray antisemetic remark. Perhaps it is more of a European phenomenom, but for my part, it really struck me as weird when I first heard that anti-Semitism was in part based upon a belief that the Jewish race was responsible for the passion and crucifxion of Jesus.

This is among the many reasons that I agree with the posted article that it was foolish for Jewish figures and groups to attack Mel Gibson's film project, and they have been doing it for almost a year. It really seemed to have a leftish Jewish orientation centered around the Frank Rich approach from his perch at the NY Times. Rich is a classic distortionartist and his attack against Gibson appeared to be particularly unfair. I really wonder at the true motives beind the early attempt to censure Gibson and warn the studios against his project. It appeared to be an attempt to snuff out a fil project but it also became part of another leftist attack against the so-called "Christian Right" of the imaginations of the NY Times and the rest of the leftist media-political nexus.

I believe that this was not an attempt to ward off anti-Semitism but rather an cynical attempt to find a vehicle with which to castigate the Christian right by tarring it with the imagined anti-Semitism supposedly inherent in Gibson's movie. The goal was to deaden the right for this 2004 election season.

I believe that just the opposite will occur. The christian right will now be unbelievably mobilized and energized in this election year, in many respects because of this movie and the way that there was this mob squad of detractors set against it. Of course, now the very culrits are now accusing Gibson of having master-minded their entire debacle as a marketing tool. [This is why the left is always too clever by half and never learns what should be its lessons.]

[Steve_Seattle]

To finish my thought about Pilate's wife: Her interference, as reported in Matthew, might be a good historical reason why Pilate - otherwise viewed by historians as cruel and brutish - seemed to be wavering and uncertain in his treatment of Jesus.

[Steve_Seattle]

You and I attended Catholic schools in an era when the anti-Semitism of earlier generations had been largely expunged from Catholic teaching. But, historically, the anti-Semitism was there at the popular level, whether or not it was there at the doctrinal level. I've heard many stories of American Jews from an older generation being taunted by Catholc children as they were growing up.

[ontos-on]

I beleive you are sincere but I do not believe that you are right. It is not a doctrinal issue. I think that your "expungement" is an explanation for not having witnessed what you have been told was true. I grew up in Queens in NYC. Large Jewish population. Of course, there were the usual stereotypical remarks that were in the air on occassions about Jews and money, etc--among some adults here and there, but really rather rare.

You changed my comments into a doctrinal question, not so. I did not experience even that in Catholic schools, that was something I am talking of the popular level. My impression has always been that American anti-semitism has been over played. Most of my friends today happen to be Jewish and they have not had experiences of such anti-semitism which is a substantial problem. I think when you resort to the stories of some school children, that you never know what you are really dealing with. Iam sure that there is antisemitism here and there. But I do not think that there is any significant historical record of antisemitism in the US. We never had pogroms, etc. I know that some schools would have jewish quotas and they probably had Catholic quotas too. Some clubs would not admit jews and a lot of other types of people. That can be called anti-semitism but is nothing like in Europe. Don't tar the US with that brush so easily.

[Ganymede]

But, without seeing the film, it seems to me, the biggest flaw is that it fails to give enough focus on the lyricism of Jesus's message of trying to transcend hatred, and live a good life, respectful of others, in hopes of an eternal reward (in other words, a just pluralistic process on this mortal coil). . . .

The movie I saw conveyed just that.

[Fenris6]

I believe that this was not an attempt to ward off anti-Semitism but rather a cynical attempt to find a vehicle with which to castigate the Christian right by tarring it with the imagined anti-Semitism supposedly inherent in Gibson's movie. The goal was to deaden the right for this 2004 election season.

You nailed it. Nicely done.

[fire_eye]

I looked very carefully at the presentation. I swear by all that is holy there was NO anti-semitism, not a hit of it.

SHHHHHH!!! Not so loud - Foxman might hear!!! I like listening to him and his gang of leftist screwballs at ADL scream and howl... Don't spoil my fun!

[Al Simmons]

"It all gets back to what Jesus said "What is the truth?". The truth to one group of people might be different to another...I watched "Schindlers List" and was moved I watched this movie now twice and was moved...what's the truth?"


The truth is that Pontius Pilate condescendingly ASKED JESUS "What is truth?"

[Salamander]

Similarly, the Rabbi complained that the Jews in the film were dressed in dark clothing, which added to the negativity of the Jews portrayed in the film. He couldn't understand why they (the Jews) couldn't have been dressed in brighter clothing like the Romans.

Compared to these modern rabbis, those guys were regular peacocks....:)

I didn't notice any "hooked noses" either, but then again I wasn't on a "spot the stereotype" quest.

If he wants to complain about "negative vibe" outfits he should check out the Pharisees in Jesus Christ Superstar.

[Fenris6]

Exactly. If you want to find sterotypes, go see that Star Wars movie (one where Anigan is a kid). That was over the line, and surprising to say the least.

[Hugin]

I just saw the movie today. My thought on all the supposed anti-Semitism was that the movie was no more anti-Semitic than Schindler's List was anti-German.

[longtermmemmory]

interesting, the first demonstration of the consequences of leading by poll numbers.

[longtermmemmory]

....organizations replenish their coffers,...
Follow the money, The end of the article has a few good
points but I was troubled by the digs at Gibsons father.
What do they expect? Gibsont "hate" his father?
Sometimes you need to let your parents just "be" out of respect.

My understanding is the "sect" he belong to is not a "sect"
They just perform the ceremonies in the old style.

As sombody said here, this is sooooo Sept 10th.

[Salamander]

Was that the one with Liam Neeson in it?
I went for a snack and never came back about 20 minutes into it.....:))
[ who were they stereotyping? that "Jar-Jar Binks is Jamaican" thing? ]

[Concerned]

There should be absolutely ZERO reason to BLAME anybody!!! Isaiah 53:10 states VERY clearly: "Yet it was the LORD's will to crush Him and cause Him to suffer, and though the LORD makes His life a guilt offering..."

Could someone...ANYONE...please point out exactly where that Scripture mentions that Jews are to be blamed for Jesus' death?

As a Christian, I don't BLAME the Jews...I THANK the LORD!!! Jesus' death and resurrection are the BEST things that have EVER happened! And we should all be THANKFUL that God is so loving, thoughtful and full of grace that He provided a way back to Him.

[Concerned]

The overall synopsis of The Passion is at Isaiah 52:13 - 53:12. Matthew, Mark, Luke and John provide the details.