Archaeologists Uncover Ayrshire Village Ancient History (Scotland - 3500BC)

Scotland Today ^ | 2-27-2004

[zeugma]

Very interesting post Fedora. If it was a glacial melt-off that was the trigger, this would also explain why the flood appears to be such a global phenom. From what I understand, just about every culture worldwide relates a flood story from its deepest history. It would be interesting to me if the flood had, in fact occurred much further back than is commonly supposed.

[blam]

"Blam, I'd be interested to hear any thoughts you have on that idea or this subject in general."

All the flood stories are related to the end of the Ice Age. Take a long look at this map with the worlds oceans reduced by a little over 300 ft. The Ice Age caused a reduction in depth of the world's ocean by 300-500ft and most scholars will accept 400ft.

Notice on the map that there are a number of major waterways that are blocked during the Ice Age...There were probably a number of examples like the Black Sea Flood. Look at the Mediterreanean (it's in two, maybe three parts) the Red Sea is landlocked and the Persian Gulf is completely dry. I think the Gulf Of Mexico also was blocked. These landlocked-blocked bodies of water would have completely dried out or eventually stabilized at a much lower level that the worlds oceans. When the water from the melting ice reached a given level, each one of the areas would have experienced a break-through and a 'Noah's Flood' that would have stayed in the collective minds of humans through the ages.

I'm toying with the idea that the Red Sea was dry or almost dry and all the fireworks/earthquakes/tsunamis, etc. associated with the 1628BC eruption of Thera/Santorini broke through the 'dam' and swept away the Egyptians who wer pursuing the Jews on their Exodus. Charred grain has been found above the Santorini ash layer but below the collapsed walls of Jerico.

There would have been millions of refugees from the Mediterranean each time the water rose high enough to break through each 'dam.'...and there is no obvious source of the water.

More at another time, lol.

[Fedora]

Very interesting post Fedora. If it was a glacial melt-off that was the trigger, this would also explain why the flood appears to be such a global phenom. From what I understand, just about every culture worldwide relates a flood story from its deepest history. It would be interesting to me if the flood had, in fact occurred much further back than is commonly supposed.

That's one possibility I'm also very interested in. On the global distribution of flood stories, here's a site which has a useful survey and summary of many Flood traditions:

Flood Stories from Around the World

Some stories seem to be closer to the Biblical story than others, and some come from cultures which had known contact with Middle Eastern tradition. The ones I find most interesting are the ones that are similar to the Biblical story but come from cultures with no known contact with Middle Eastern tradition.

[blam]

This analysis does not consider that the land masses under the ice sheets would have been severly depressed/compressed and at the same time, land to the south would have been 'sticking-up', something like a see-saw. Most of the melt water went 'the-other-way.' (somewhere through the Scandanavian countries?) And, that's why the Black Sea water level was still depressed by 550ft in 5600BC. All that fresh water didn't go through there?

[Fedora]

All the flood stories are related to the end of the Ice Age. Take a long look at this map with the worlds oceans reduced by a little over 300 ft. The Ice Age caused a reduction in depth of the world's ocean by 300-500ft and most scholars will accept 400ft.

Cool map! :) I see what you're saying about the Mediterranean. I'm also noticing interesting things around the Bering Strait, Hudson Bay (or the lack thereof!), the Caribbean, the British "Isles", Japan, and Indonesia. As Mr. Spock would say, "Fascinating." :)

More at another time, lol.

Sounds good :)

[zeugma]

I think I found that site once when I was looking for information about Gilgamesh. Pretty cool. I too am much more interested in the flood stories from peoples without known contact with middle-eastern culture and tradtions. They give credibility to the flood that nothing else does.

[Fedora]

This analysis does not consider that the land masses under the ice sheets would have been severly depressed/compressed and at the same time, land to the south would have been 'sticking-up', something like a see-saw.

True--at least in the absence of any other offsetting factors. Any other geologic events that may have also affected this, like for instance any major tectonic activity at the end of the Ice Age?

Most of the melt water went 'the-other-way.' (somewhere through the Scandanavian countries?) And, that's why the Black Sea water level was still depressed by 550ft in 5600BC. All that fresh water didn't go through there?

Interesting--I will have to think about that. What would the effect of glacial runoff have been on the rivers running into the Black Sea from its non-Mediterranean shores--Danube, Dnesst, Dnepr, Don? I'm thinking on analogy with what happened with the Mississippi River, Lake Agassiz, and Hudson Bay in North America and trying to visualize how that would apply to the Black Sea.

[blam]

"I'm also noticing interesting things around the Bering Strait, Hudson Bay (or the lack thereof!), the Caribbean, the British "Isles", Japan, and Indonesia.

Dr Robert Schoch (geologist/geophysist), speculates in his recent book Voyages Of The Pyramid Builders, that the inhabitants of Sundaland took to the seas as their land went underwater at the end of the Ice Age and took their custom of pyramid building with them all over the world. Interesting book.

BTW, Schoch says the underwater 'pyramids' found off the coast of Japan are natural formations. I saw a 'special' where he was swimming around these structures in scuba equipment.

[blam]

"What would the effect of glacial runoff have been on the rivers running into the Black Sea from its non-Mediterranean shores--Danube, Dnesst, Dnepr, Don?"

I actually read a scientific refutation of your article in post #20. My memory on it is faint but I do remember that they said the water did not stream into the Black Sea...But, I can't remember where they said it went. (ugh)

[Fedora]

I think I found that site once when I was looking for information about Gilgamesh.

You may have seen this thread already, but if not you may be interested:

IRAQ: Gilgamesh tomb believed found

[Fedora]

Dr Robert Schoch (geologist/geophysist), speculates in his recent book Voyages Of The Pyramid Builders, that the inhabitants of Sundaland took to the seas as their land went underwater at the end of the Ice Age and took their custom of pyramid building with them all over the world. Interesting book.

Thanks, I'll check that out! I've been exploring the possibility of contact between pyramid/ziggurat builders in Sumeria, Egypt, and India; didn't know about Indonesia. BTW speaking of that I recently started a book (another one!--LOL!) about a Pacific island with megaliths called Nan Madol, which might relate to Schoch's thesis.

BTW, Schoch says the underwater 'pyramids' found off the coast of Japan are natural formations. I saw a 'special' where he was swimming around these structures in scuba equipment.

I recently read somewhere that they seemed to be natural, too. Have you heard any recent progress in the research into the ones off Cuba?

[Fedora]

I actually read a scientific refutation of your article in post #20. My memory on it is faint but I do remember that they said the water did not stream into the Black Sea...But, I can't remember where they said it went. (ugh)

LOL! That's what happened to me the other day when I was trying to remember the title of one of the books I was trying to tell you about. :) I'll keep an eye out for refutations of the article.

[blam]

"Have you heard any recent progress in the research into the ones off Cuba?"

No. Schoch said that from all that he has seen on this (presumably he's seen as much as us and probably more), they are natural structures too.

[blam]

Nan Madol

(A quick check of Schoch's book didn't turn up any mention of Nan Madol)

[Fedora]

Nan Madol

Thanks, nice picture, and I see the site that links to has some other good pics as well.

Getting ready to watch the Oscars here, so I'll check back later. Have a good one!

[blam]

"Getting ready to watch the Oscars here."

That's a waste of time. I'm watching War Stories with Oliver North. Later.

[Fedora]

"Getting ready to watch the Oscars here."

That's a waste of time.

Usually is :) I usually skip it, but I'm a Tolkien fan so this year I want to see how LotR does. Show's starting now--later!

[AEMILIUS PAULUS]

There are some villages in the Dordogne region of France that have floors of stones and pebbles laid down in the Paleolithic.

[blam]

"There are some villages in the Dordogne region of France that have floors of stones and pebbles laid down in the Paleolithic."

That's amazing. I was moaning the other day that my house is now 12 years old.

[SunkenCiv]

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