German Ship Seized with Uranium (enrichment)-Making Parts for Libya (for nuclear bomb)

Deutsche Welle ^ | Jan. 1, 2003 | DW staff

[FairOpinion]

"A majority of Germans opposed the Iraq war,"

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Fine, then let them fend for themselves and not expect the US to give them plum Iraqi contracts.

Actions have consequences.

And Bush is NOT unpopular "in Europe". He may be unpopular in the "old Europe", who turned socialist, while East Europe threw down their socialist shakles. The E. European countries have been very supportive of Bush and the war in Iraq.

[FairOpinion]

"But still we are allies."

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Too bad Schroder didn't remember that, when he and Chirac were doing everything to protect Saddam and thwart the US.

"A friend in need is a friend indeed". Schroder and Chiract decided to throw in with our enemies, when we needed them. Those are NOT the actions of "allies and friends".

[FairOpinion]

"Until the majority in your country (Germany) reject marxism and socialism....we don't have a lot in common."

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BINGO! Exactly.

You can also add, that until they stop supporting our enemies, like Saddam and Khaddafi, we have nothing in common and they are no friends of ours, obviously.

Tony Blair is a liberal in the UK, yet he recognized the danger, and who his friends are and supported us.

Germany and France even had the choice to merely stay neutral. Instead, they chose to try to rally other nations AGAINST the US, in addition to their attack on us.

[Lady Heron]

This article does not state that it was German parts that were being shipped, just that a German shipping company was moving the parts, that when asked, went to Italy instead of Libya and let the Americans inspect what was being shipped. You can get mad at Germany when if it is discovered that they were German parts, not just some German shipping company moving crates of goods.

The real question did they know what they were shipping?

[desertcry]

French made, german ship, that's why libya decided to give up it's plan for building nuclear bombs. The libyans thought it was not worth the risk, using french made parts. It was a bait and switch deal that Gaddafi's got, he thought he was going to get german parts shipped via a french ship. HAHAHAH!

[marron]

I would like a lot more information before going too far with my comments. The article leaves out some important information. Where were the parts from, where did the parts ship from, and will that company be prosecuted by their country of origin...

The fact that it was a German ship may or may not mean much, the ships captain certainly knows whats on the manifest but if you are shipping nuclear processing machinery it may or may not be obvious to a seaman what the ultimate purpose of a piece of machinery may be.

The fact that the company, and the German government cooperated with our actions may or may not mean much. They were evidently helpful, but once we had intelligence on that ship, they really couldn't have denied us, we would have seized the ship on the high seas if necessary.

Germany is well known to have aided Saddam's nuclear program prior to the first Gulf War, and people are suspicious that some German companies may have continued to assist the Iraqis after that time, trans-shipping important components by way of the Balkans and other middle men. There were reports of this kind of thing prior to the war, although I haven't heard much since the war. Does this mean it wasn't true, or does it mean we are getting our ducks in a row before confronting the governments involved? I can't answer that, obviously. But the suspicion remains.

If German companies were providing Libya with nuclear technology, it remains to be seen if they are effectively prosecuted. I remember the German nuclear engineer who was given a suspended sentence for his work on Iraq's nuclear program, because it was essentially done with the knowledge of the German government. I wonder if the same thing will happen again here.

[anglian]

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1039395/posts

[Alamo-Girl]

I imagine he would be. Thanks for the ping!

[sarasmom]

I wouldnt make such a big issue of Germans guarding US/NATO bases in Germany, if I were you.
Having an only slightly outdated knowledge of the financial terms of US bases in NATO countries, I am certain the USA is paying through the nose for those German guards...
Frankly,I would rather the USA hired Poland's military to guard our hopefully temporary assets in Germany, just untill we are finished with the move!
I do agree it is silly to condemn Germany for the ships cargo, untill all the facts are released.
I am certain the government of the USA is taking appropriate actions.
Maybe not what I would consider appropriate actions, and for that everyone involved should thank God! I am done with useless diplomatic gestures.

[Michael81Dus]

Actually, the German government pays 1 billion $ each year for the 90-some facilities of the US Armed Forces in Germany. Germany gets no money from the States for the bases, but a) soldiers and their families spend some money here and b) in return Germany is granted the right to use bases on US soil for Air combat training. And the protection of your facilities here is just a nice gesture, we call this mission "Host Nation Support".

[Michael81Dus]

I refer to my government, so please show me where my government is working against the war on terrorism. Fanatics are even in your rows, you can hardly blame the government for that.

[Michael81Dus]

The article (or another) states that the ship passed the Suez Channel. When I would head from Germany for Lybia, I had to cround Africa to pass the Suez Channel... not very likely. So I think the ship came from Asia and was then ordered to Italy. The company (http://www.bbc-online.) has world players as its customers and good references. I don´t think that they need to make dirty deals. It´s only a cargo company. If I were having an dirty deal with bad guys, I wouldn´t inform too many...

[AdamSelene235]

The last time I looked, a majority of Americans supported the UN as well. Americans really really like Michael Moore. He's only in the last couple of weeks come down from the number one spot. He's been on the bestseller list for ages in the States. If his booksales in Germany demonstrate something, what does it also demonstrate about our own country?

Precisely the same thing it shows about Germany; The fact that intellectual,cultural,spiritual, and moral decadence has come to pervade the Western societies. This Counter-Enlightment has its origins in 19th Century England and Germany. Marxism forked into the Stalinist and Fabian approaches. Fabian Socialism is now the preferred method of suicide among Western Nations.

We're the healthiest patient in the cancer ward. You need only read the European draft constitution to understand that the Enlightenment has died there and is now receding. We should not seek friendship or advice with these nations. Cooperation will suffice.

[sarasmom]

You may want to research your figures in more depth.

A quick google search turns up a rather different scenario.

http://www.heritage.org/Research/Europe/hl782.cfm

Other information freely available on the internet shows the cost to the USA to maintain bases in Germany is about 7 billion a year.
I was based in Germany and knew many German nationals employed by the USAF, not expensed to joint NATO funds.
Aside from the positive economic impact of any military installation to any town, or village in your case, the actual burden of costs is much more favorable to Germany than to the USA.
NATO spends money, and Germany contributes quite a bit.
No argument there.
It costs the USA much more than it costs Germany to keep those bases open.
We should, and will close most of them in the next 10 years.
It will begin to impact your economy, and ours, heavily in 2005.
Sorry about that.../sarcasm//

[Michael81Dus]

http://www.germany-info.org/relaunch/info/publications/infocus/bases/American_bases_in_Germany_fs.pdf

Oh, my informations are correct. Sure, the US government pays more for the bases than the Germans - but the US government is not paying to the German state, only for their own costs.

Germany is, behind the US, the 2nd largest contributor to NATO. Right, no argument here.

We´re going to see how things will change. One´s for sure: the large number of troops won´t be kept in Europe. Even the Eastern European countries won´t get too many GI´s...