Teen pulling prank killed by neighbor

The Palm Beach Post ^ | Sunday, October 26 | Sarah Eisenhauer and Cynthia Kopkowski

[longtermmemmory]

no but it would explain the absence of the race baiters.

[longtermmemmory]

nope sparky retired, we now have pokey the needle.

[elfman2]

"The only way to show beyond a reasonable doubt that there was a threat is to wake up dead or hospitalized in the morning."

I think that a very consistent story from the shooter plus a good reputation would establish confidence beyond a reasonable doubt. A pattern of what the kid did to other people would help, or statements by other family members or even people who showed up moments after the shooting would cover him. If the shooter has none of that, I think he should be up for murder.

I don’t doubt what you say about NC law. But I don’t think that’s morally right. I like the consistency of reasonable doubt being required to take a life in and out of court. It’s “reasonable” for me to think today’s a good picnic day, but there’s a 20% chance of rain. Because the consequences of taking the wrong life is much more grave than having a picnic rained out, I think the standards should be much higher.

[fjsva]

>> "If they thought it was a burglar, what kind of burglar knocks?" <<

It's called Home Invasion. One person knocks to get you to open the door. Then you get rushed by the knocker or a group. Have read many stories in paper.

[muawiyah]

Sorry to hear about your cousin.

Look, I was once awakened early in the morning when an innebriated individual fell against the door of my apartment.

Hillary Clinton owes her life to the fact that I am not in the practice of shooting people who drop by unexpected like that.

Sometimes I think folks who shoot strangers at the door are using drugs. Guns and drugs don't mix.

[thathamiltonwoman]

Four years ago while my husband was working the night shift a teenager decided it would be funny to bang and kick on my front door around midnight. It woke me up out of a deep sleep. I called 911 and prayed that the door would hold. It took the cops 10 minutes to arrive. The kid would kick the door, giggle and run. Then he'd come back and repeat the perfomance. By the time the cops arrived the kid was gone. They did a cursory search of the area, took my statement and that was it.

My husband bought us a gun the next day. We never had another problem but if I'd been armed that night and IF that kid had managed to kick the door open he'd be dead now. I can certainly sympathize with the man in this case.

[BOBWADE]

Please give us more details since you were there and know what happened.

[longtermmemmory]

Of course the intersting point: What if this was a home invasion gone bad? Would the friends and family of the boy be beyond LYING about this being a harmless prank?

(in the middle east it is common practice to have arabs quickly remove weapons and hide them in order to claim unarmed civilians were "unarmed". There is also the staged palestinian funeral with the living dead body.)

[Shooter 2.5]

And yelling it from the confines of your home make it difficult to figure out where you're yelling from. In an apartment, you could be yelling it from behind the relative hard cover of a refrigerator.

On the street, I was told to yell, "Please, back off" as loud as possible. The emphasis was on the word "Please" because in a stressful situation, it could be interpreted by others as "Police". Any little edge helps.

[FITZ]

at 16 and out at 12:30, the kid may have had a juvenile record. Do we know the race of the parties?

Whatever his race, knocking on a door as a prank isn't that big a crime. I remember when kids would toilet paper yards, wax windows. My dad's generation did pranks as teenagers, my grandfather was involved in some ----way worse ones than knocking on a door.

I guess when crime was less a problem, people weren't so jumpy, people didn't used to be so afraid of a knock on their front door. It's sad because kids are still kids but now it's dangerous to do things they always have.

[Voice in your head]

"'They were playing knock on the door and run,' said one family member.

If that is true, then why was the kid there when the man answered the door? I guess he forgot the "run" part of the game, or he had some other motive. Perhaps he only ran when he heard people coming to answer the door and was trying to find a vacant home to burglarize?

[HighWheeler]

"What is so important that you are defending that you need a gun?" said Quiroga, the mother

Stupid question gets the general answer:

How about my life and the lives of my family? Important enough, Quiroga The Mother?

[Jorge]

Apparently, both the shooter and the deceased had bad judgement.

Exactly.

I've remember hearing a story about some kid who played a prank on his father, and scared him so bad the father accidently shot and killed him.

You never know how a "prank" might turn out.

[coloradan]

Home invasion robberies are a bit more common today than 20 or 50 years ago.

[Mulder]

But you will find that some posters on FR believe that training is "infringement" and think the poor kid got what he deserved. Sad.

Any kid, especially one that is as big as a pro football player, that comes knocking on doors with mischevious intent after dark is asking for trouble. Period.

What do you think the punk did once unsuspecting folks opened the door? Smile and introduce himself as a neighbor?

More than likely, he did something that was intented to scare the hell out of the homeowner, which probably involved the threat of some use of force.

The homeowner had the smarts to get a CCW permit so he could defend himself. He also has the smarts to not be talking to press. He's done two things right, while the only thing the perp has going for him is that his worthless family thinks he a "good kid that didn't deserve to die". We've only heard their side of the story, because the homeowner is very wisely not talking to the press.

Also, the police did not arrest the homeowner. That should tell you something also.

[BOOTSTICK]

I live in Florida {Tampa Bay area}, here we have had similar incidences, a man drunk knocking on a door, he beleived to be his home, instead was the home of his neighbor. The elederly woman who FEARED FOR HER LIFE, shot through the door, killing the drunk. No charges were filed, since Florida law allows lethal force, if an individual "fears great bodily harm, or loss of life". The comments of the parents in this case are understandable, yet nonetheless assinine. A few years ago I happened to be awake at 2 AM when I heard a noise outside my front door. I went out my backdoor with my pump shotgun, and confronted two teens at my front door, who were placing a matress against my door. They said they were only doing a prank, yet I was of the beleif they were going to break in with the matress to muffle the noise. The expressions on their faces were priceless when I racked my pump, and told them, if they moved , they would be chasing their heads down Main Street. Both were arrested and charged with disorderly conduct.

[Smokin' Joe]

Levin's doorbell was not the only one the boys rang Saturday morning. Residents up and down the 6100 block of Woodbury reported being awakened by ringing doorbells and knocks shortly after midnight. Most said they sloughed it off or answered the door, found nobody there and went back to bed. But a second round of frantic pounding and shouting from Drewes' friend minutes later caught their attention.

Carol Quiroga, who lives across the street from Levin, heard nothing outside as she made her way to bed minutes before the shooting -- no arguing, no scuffling. A loud "pop," broke the silence, followed by someone saying calmly, "Call 911" once, then again, she said. What sounded like a boy's voice came next, saying "Help. I need help."

Testimony conflicts. If all these doorbells were rung and doors knocked on, how come Quiroga didn't hear any of it? Not even running, laughing, pranksters. IMHO this is being spun as an anti CCW story, even to the point of repeating unconfirmed allegations of the kid being shot in the back, well enough to give a couple of participants here the impression that the kid was shot in the back by the 'evil concealed weapons permit holder'.

The 'facts', as presented, do not add up.

[beaversmom]

You never do this. You just gave away your position if the burglar is armed. Your house walls will not stop the bullet coming towards you.

That's silly. As presented, the guy had time to think before he shot out. The guy outside is not going to know his exact position if he yells out from inside the house. If he's worried about that he can crouch down or hide behind something. I understand the saying that it's better to be tried by 12 than carried by 6, but they are probably going to make this guy's life a living hell. He had options and he took a life and really messed up his own. I wouldn't want to be in his shoes right now even if they didn't pursue anything legal.

[HighWheeler]

That owner in your story should get life in prison. What a POS.

[Ditter]

Regardless of what we have seen kids do in the past, we are talking about this particular boy. Didn't the article say he had been ringing doorbells all over the neighborhood? Did he do anything other than this childish trick at any of the other houses? For whatever reason, this man overreacted & this boy died. A man sized boychild should not have been playing childish pranks in the middle of the night & this man should not have shot someone running away from him. I see the man as being more at fault than the boy, because he used deadly force when it was not needed.