FBI, Pentagon Quiz Microsoft on XP

dailynews.yahoo.com ^

[Dominic Harr]

But when you say "only this time, there is proof that they knew 5 weeks ago" doesn't that imply that asserting that prior bugs were known but not revealed was mere speculation?

I'm not talking about issuing a patch, I'm talking about selling a product they knew was defective.

Are you suggesting that we should allow companies to sell products they know to be defective?

[TaRaRaBoomDeAyGoreLostToday!]

I recieved no such notification of an update as my entire puter and XP was brand new.I found the patch/info. because of FR.

[Dominic Harr]

You do.

Let me get this straight -- you believe a company can knowingly sell a defective product legally?

[Glenn]

you believe a company can knowingly sell a defective product legally?

As opposed to giving it away like Linux?

Can you cite law or not? Do you believe laws that apply to gas tanks are the same ones that cover software?

[Dominic Harr]

If a car dealer sells me an auto in which the radio doesn't work, and they *knew* it didn't work yet chose not to inform me, I have legal recourse.

That same law applies in this case.

[TruthShallSetYouFree]

Most consumer protection laws are enforced by the individual states. Here is the one for Massachusetts, for example:

link

[brewcrew]

Is this a vulnerability to networked computers only?

I would have liked to see if our machine had upnp enabled before we downloaded and installed the patch. Never thought to do that.

I believe it is a vulnerability for anyone who is connected to the internet. Get behind a firewall like Black Ice or Zone Alarm.

[verboten]

Well I agree that MS encounters many problems. But the very purpose of the market is to determine through trial and error what is good and what is bad. It is impossible for anyone to predict all things. This does not stop the government from asserting it can, but a realistic consideration tells us that only by giving a product to the world can its strengths and weaknesses be fully determined.

Possibly the reason that a clever 14 year old can break software is because he is 14. His mind has not been subjected to the forces of conformity. He did not attend a college computer class where some ivory tower professor told him how to do things. The 14 year old with his youthful energy tries everything. And in trying everything he stumples across many more truths than the average MS programmer learned in 4 years of college, and 10 years at MS.

[Dominic Harr]

So MS defenders don't want Anti-trust laws or consumer protection laws to apply to MS.

What is it about MS that makes people put them above the law?

[Glenn]

That same law applies in this case.

You can't be serious.

[Dominic Harr]

Thank you for looking that up. I didn't even see a need to 'prove' that, since I know the MS defenders know the truth and are just obfuscating on purpose.

May I quote from your link?

When you buy a product from a merchant, by state law it comes with an automatic warranty which says that the product will function normally, for its intended purpose, for a reasonable period of time. This is an implied warranty of merchantability.

If the product is defective at purchase, or becomes defective during the period of the implied warranty, both the seller and the manufacturer are responsible for making it right.

Under Massachusetts law, a merchant cannot sell a product "as is." A store's regular return policy does not apply in the case of defective goods.

[Dominic Harr]

You can't be serious.

What, that the law should apply to MS?

Believe it or not, yes it should.

[Glenn]

So MS defenders don't want Anti-trust laws or consumer protection laws to apply to MS.

Expectations for software are different than those of autmobiles. You must be awfully new to the industry not to understand that.

[big'ol_freeper]

Buy a Mac!!!

[Balding_Eagle]

Can you cite this law, please?

Seriously?

Yes, please cite. There is no such law, what you are posting is a figment of your imagination.

[TruthShallSetYouFree]

May I quote from your link?

Apparently, you already did. I'll sue :)

[Dominic Harr]

Expectations for software are different than those of autmobiles.

You're referring to the EULA, which tries to claim that the software company isn't liable for anything.

Such a contract is illegal and completely unenforcable, like the EULA restriction in MS's 'FrontPage' that says you can't use the software to make a site that criticizes MS.

You can't contractually remove basic consumer rights. If a company knowingly sells a defective product without informing customers of that defect, they have broken the law.

[Balding_Eagle]

Let me get this straight -- you believe a company can knowingly sell a defective product legally?

Happens every day.

[TruthShallSetYouFree]

The 14 year old with his youthful energy tries everything. And in trying everything he stumples across many more truths than the average MS programmer learned in 4 years of college, and 10 years at MS.

Are you lurking, Mr. Gates? We've stumbled upon an ultimate truth. Start hiring some clever fourteen year-olds. (Probably wouldn't be a bad idea.)

[Amerigomag]

MS has known about the exploit for 5 weeks

Wrong!

MS has know about the potential for the problem since the design phase of W2k and ME, more than two years ago.

Steve Gibson tried to warn them in June 2001 but they wouldn't listen. A hacker finally got around to probing the know weakness this past summer. MS was notified some weeks ago.