White House Drug Czar Recommends Drug Testing in Schools

Associated Press ^ | Oct. 8, 2003

[ellery]

I told you why I used 1993 -- because 1991 was the benchmark low for incarcerations, and 1993 was the first data point for drug use after that! We can go back to the spike in incarcerations (the benchmark high) -- but I thought that would make things too confusing.

I will look up the stats for state/local incarceration to get the best apples to apples comparison -- but please don't accuse me of trying to stack the deck...I've been scrupulously fair about representing stats.

[ellery]

Furthermore, I only stopped at '98 and then did 99-01 b/c you pointed out the data break! Do you want me to compare from 93-03, or don't you?

[headsonpikes]

You assume that I give a rat's *ss about the unsupported opinions of your chosen authority.

Without a foundation in reason, your morality is indistinguishable from any number of heathen codes.

Indistinguishable from totalitarian ideology, as well, so far as I can tell.

[robertpaulsen]

"You assume that I give a rat's *ss about the unsupported opinions of your chosen authority."

Well, in that case your question should have been, "What moral basis is there for drug prohibition that I would give a rat's *ss about?"

That would have been easier to answer -- None that I know of.

[StriperSniper]

what drugs are they going to test for?

Ritalin?

Yeah, to make sure they are taking it. :-|

[headsonpikes]

There could be many moral bases for your argument that I would care about, just not an indefensible argument from authority.

Having refused to move on from your unsupportable position, you accuse me of bad faith.

Sorry. That's just another tactical evasion, your speciality, evidently.

[robertpaulsen]

Hold on, please. You're confusing me yet again.

Are you trying to track incarcerations or arrests? Your basic argument and your post #181 refer to incarcerations, yet you're citing a "benchmark low" and a "spike" from the arrest graph.

I thought you admitted you didn't know what the states incarceration numbers were. Once obtained, the incarceration graph may have different "spikes" and "lows" than the arrest graph.

Then we can see how the incarceration graph lines up with the drug-use graph.

One last thing to really screw things up. We should break down the incarcerations to show users and dealers.

The reason? If we're incarcerating mostly drug dealers, say 90%, drug users are going to feel pretty immune. If I were a drug user and saw that the police were arresting, prosecuting, and incarcerating mostly drug dealers, that criminal justice activity would have very little affect on my use of drugs. As a matter of fact, the more drug dealers arrested, the safer I, as a user, would feel.

On the other hand, if the government is going after users and incarcerating them in large numbers, I'm gonna get concerned because I may be next. That could influence my behavior.

[Lord_Baltar]

A Muzzle? Bush nominated the guy, and his views were well known before...

His views ARE Bush's views...

[robertpaulsen]

"There could be many moral bases for your argument that I would care about, just not an indefensible argument from authority."

We'll see about that in a moment.

If I'm going to give you a moral basis, then I going to cite a moral authority. Where else would you have me obtain it, James Carville?

But if you're serious about pursuing this, I need to know if you consider the use of recreational drugs to be immoral? If you don't, then I can never give you an answer to your question that you would accept.

Assuming you do, I need to know what you're looking for. It would help me if you answered the question, "What moral basis is there for prohibiting theft?" (I assume you'll agree theft is immoral, which is why it is necessary for you to feel the same about drug use.)

Then I'll know how to phrase my answer in a similar way.

[headsonpikes]

I see that you are obdurate in your defense of the argument from authority.

Indeed, you seem to be unable to imagine a non-authoritarian argument.

I'm disappointed.

[shiva]

This post is in DU. They found it interesting enough to post since it's about their favorite past time....DRUGS. LOL!