Patrick J. Buchanan Examines "The Slow Awakening of George W."

Washington Times ^ | 09-17-03 | Buchanan, Patrick J.

[ninenot]

The fact is, the bulk of the productive jobs are created by Big Business. MSFT, AT&T, GM, Ford, etc.

Are you absolutely out of your mind, or merely living about 60 years ago?

EVERY commentator knows that SMALL business creates more jobs, annually, than BigBiz.

You may claim that GM buys from small business, thus "creating" jobs--but to state that T, F, GM are 'creating' jobs is ludicrous. Every one of them (with the exception of MSFT) has cut workers, severely, in the last 10 years.

[hchutch]

We've treated successful businessmen like Bill Gates as if they were scum - from the Great Society on. The chickens have come home to roost, to borrow the old phrase.

Rather than stopping and dealing with the hostile busienss climate that has been created, we're talking about more of the same-old Washington DC based solutions. We kept kicking Big Business around - and never though tthat they would get tired of it. Well, they got tired of it.

Until America realzies we need Big Business more than they need us, we will not solve the trade deficit or the outsourcing. And descent into the class warfare used by the Left will only accelerate the trends.

[ninenot]

Why do you refuse to acknowledge this fact? Why do you continue to demand the false solution of tariffs?

Evidently you cannot read.

No sensible 'fair trade' FR groupie has EVER claimed that taxation and regulation are GOOD things. Some fringe-types think that raising the minimum wage is a solution, but that's not credible, nor does it represent the thought of Laz, or Willie.

We all start from the same premise: it is the CITIZEN, the worker, the manager, the executive, to whom the GUmmint owes allegiance. Not obscure owls, snakes, or puddles. Not Chinamen. Not bureaucrats.

We also realize that the Gummint has both good and bad policy.

Our concern is that ALL of it is fixed, not just parts.

However, we are not impressed by arguments that "What's good for GM is good for the USA." That's horsehockey.

What is good for the CITIZENS is good for the USA. If it benefits GM, fine.

[hchutch]

They all started out as small businesses. I've mentioned Bill Gates and Microsoft with malice aforethought.

All I see from you is the same class warfare that comes from the left wing of the Democratic party. I hear "progressives" whining asbout corporate interests and how they declare war on America.

You want to do that, fine. But I'm going to point out you are using the class warfare tactics of the Left. Maybe you ought to go to DU. It will fit in better.

[hchutch]

But where will the PRODUCTIVE employment come from if you don't have GM or Mircosoft?

Small business can't do it alone.

[ninenot]

. I hear "progressives" whining asbout corporate interests and how they declare war on America.

There's a movement afoot to break the National Ass'n of Manufacturers into two groups: "Importers" and "Producers."

Those firms whose products are >50% US-made would be classified as "Producers;"--less than 50% would be classified as "Importers."

Firms who are importers are clearly not all that interested in the citizens of the USA, are they?

[Lazamataz]

F*** it. Let the whole thing collapse. I'm getting past caring. So what if America goes the way of Venezuala? So what if there are no longer any American jobs? So what if Hillary gets voted in, in 2004?

Free Traitors want the country destroyed, so fine. Destroy it.

[hchutch]

Hey, I'm sick and damn tired of people who want to play class warfare bulls***. We treated business like crap, and they've decided we can go to hell. When I was looking for a new car the week before Labor Day, one dealer pretty much treated me like dirt. I decided not to put up with that crap. I went to another dealer, and actually got a better bargain and a good car in the process.

Business is doing the same. We're reaping the consequences of 40+ years of class warfare against profitable businesses in the United states of America.

You want to duck the reponsibility of fixing that mess, and blame it on "Free Traitors" the way Bill Clinton blames other people for the consequences of his fooling around in the Oval Office, I can't stop you from doing that, but I will point it out.

I'm not going to roll over for anyone who has their hand out shouting, "Gimme, gimme, I'm entitled," and I don't give a f*** if is it you or Jesse Jackson. DO YOU UNDERSTAND?

[Lazamataz]

I'm not going to roll over for anyone who has their hand out shouting, "Gimme, gimme, I'm entitled," and I don't give a f*** if is it you or Jesse Jackson. DO YOU UNDERSTAND?

I'm not entitled. I just want a fair chance to compete with foreigners, without currency manipulation that makes them 3 times as cheap as me; without needing to compete against slave labor; without needing to compete against countries who don't have ANY EPA or labor regulations.

But I clearly ask too much. I, along with the rest of the middle class, will gladly die now. We understand we are no longer needed or wanted.

[MrLeRoy]

#1 If you go $200,000 into debt on credit cards you will have to pay it back plus interest. You pay to "rent" this money. Same with the USA if we buy so much more from China and they hold US Treasuries rather than spend it, which in fact is what they do. Once more interest is collected as it is from all debtors.

The problem here is the debt, not what's done with the money. Should we refuse to sell Treasury securities to foreigners?

#2 Let's say you own two busy auto repair shops. You can sell one for $200,000 and be debt free. Same for the USA. The Chinese can take $100 million of the US Treasuries they hold and buy some productive assets in the USA. Could be farms, factories, income producing real estate what have you.

So we get their goods and they get farms, factories, and real estate that stay in this country---while the sellers of same get to reinvest in even more productive assets.

[Lazamataz]

PS: Hillary is running in 2004, and she will make it in to office easily so long as Bush continues to pay lip-service to the jobs crisis in America. We should be adding jobs at 100,000 a month at this point in a recovery. Instead we are shedding 98,000.

Enjoy Hillary.

Frankly, I'm past giving a s**t.

[Texas_Dawg]

So what if America goes the way of Venezuala? So what if there are no longer any American jobs?

No kidding. I thought you were moving to Russia anyway.

So what if Hillary gets voted in, in 2004?

Are we all doomed?

[LIBERATENJ]

We Need A Job-Saving Law
written by Dr. Walter Williams

Recent advocacy of free trade in this column has caused considerable reader apoplexy, anxiety, not to mention accusations of
unconcern with worker plight. Readers have protested loss of good paying jobs to low-wage countries such as India, China
and other Asian countries. I'd like to propose a way to completely eliminate this angst and I'm wondering just how many of my
fellow Americans would support it. Let's call it the Level Playing Field Act where Congress decrees that: Neither a corporation
nor an individual shall be permitted to employ a cheaper method of producing a good or service.

The Level Playing Field Act would be a blessing for all those highly paid workers in the high-tech industry, auto, steel and other
industries who see their jobs going to overseas workers earning far less than half their wages. To produce the most successful
outcome, Congress would have to complement this law with a similar decree on the consumer side of things namely: Neither a
corporation nor an individual shall be permitted to purchase a cheaper good or service.

This job-saving measure wouldn't only apply to jobs lost to low-wage countries but it would also apply to automation caused
by job-destroying machines. England's nineteenth century Luddites, understood this very well but they took matters into their
own hands and went about destroying job-destroying machinery. I can sympathize with the Luddites. After all it's no less painful
to a worker who loses his job because the corporation has moved his job overseas than to a worker who loses his job to a
cost-saving machine. Either way he's out of a job.

Being 67 years old, I've witnessed a lot of job destruction. As a young man I enjoyed watching road construction. At that time
road construction required enormous teams of men doing everything from using jack hammers and pick axes to dig up cracked
pavement to using long two-by-fours to even out and finish the concrete. We just don't see much of this now. These good
paying jobs have been destroyed by huge machines operated by a few men who do the work that it took hundreds of men to
do yesteryear. Had the Level Playing Field Act been on the books, we'd still have those jobs.

Job-destroying machines haven't spared women. Yesteryear thousands of women had good paying jobs as telephone
switchboard operators. Switching machines and later computers destroyed those jobs. Five and dime stores had one or two
ladies behind every counter to help customers. Check-out stands and packaging have destroyed all of those jobs. The Level
Playing Field Act would have saved those jobs.

Then there's the consumer side of things. Years ago there were loads of corner grocery and hardware stores. Because of selfish
consumers, motivated only by getting something cheap and not caring about what happens to small businessmen and their
employees, these stores are mostly gone. They've been replaced by huge, impersonal supermarket chains and super hardware
stores like Home Depot and Loews. Had my proposed law been on the books small grocery and hardware stores would not
have gone the way of the dinosaur.

Some people might argue that what I'm proposing is too extreme. They might say, "We're just talking about saving all of our
high-tech and manufacturing jobs going overseas." Such a position seems selfish and self-serving in the least. After all one of the
overriding values of a free society is equality before the law. That means if Congress takes measure to save the job of one
American it's obliged to save the jobs of all Americans. No worker is more deserving than another. That means there can't be
job-saving discrimination.

Walter E. Williams
c39-03
September 8, 2003

[Lazamataz]

Troll_Dawg, you add nothing to any discussion whatsoever.

[hchutch]

Not my fault that the middle class forgot that a poor person never gave anyone a job.

When the middle class went along with class warfare, they did it to themselves as far as I am concerned. I guess I'm expecting too much for them to be mature enough to accept responsibility for it.

No, they're going to find a boogeyman to blame. And the problems will never get solved. That attitude gave Bill Clinton a pass over impeachment. That attitude has a chance of giving us Hillary.

The only reason I'm posting what I'm posting on these threads is because I *DO* give a f*** what happens to this country.

When you are ready tod ump the class warfare, get back to me. Otherwise, why not take the class warfare to DU where it belongs?

[Texas_Dawg]

Troll_Dawg, you add nothing to any discussion whatsoever.

Are you worried about Japan subsidizing its industry and manipulating the yen? Your crowd has been screaming about how this was going to kill us all for over a decade.

[Lazamataz]

Williams, who says he is a professor, should know better. His article was disassembled and refuted at length on the thread in which that article was posted.

Just a note to you: Please don't post entire articles to a thread, especially when that article has already been posted (several times, in this case) as it's own thread.

[Lazamataz]

Not my fault that the middle class forgot that a poor person never gave anyone a job. When the middle class went along with class warfare, they did it to themselves as far as I am concerned. I guess I'm expecting too much for them to be mature enough to accept responsibility for it.

The middle class did this with the urging of the Democrats.

But your solution is to let this job destruction continue unabated? You are okay with the destruction of the middle class? You are okay with a small elitist population and a vast poor class? You think the middle class needs 'punished' for their horrible deeds, to the point that they are all made poor?

This is how you give a f*** about the country?

Seems we'd be better off if you didn't care after all.

When you are ready tod ump the class warfare, get back to me. Otherwise, why not take the class warfare to DU where it belongs?

Oh, bite me. I've never once employed class warfare. I'm only interested in America having a few paltry jobs so that there is any middle class at all.

[hchutch]

People have to live with the consuquences of their actions. I call that personal responsibility. Is that a foreign concept to you?

[Lazamataz]

Are you worried about Japan subsidizing its industry and manipulating the yen? Your crowd has been screaming about how this was going to kill us all for over a decade.

Not any more. Their experiment failed. Your country, China, looks like it has a lot more resources behind it. And while Japan didn't destroy us, they sure did a lot of damage to a lot of people.