Proposed Base Closure 2005

2 Sept 03 | Email

[Vigilantcitizen]

"I've talked to people who know people at a major home construction. The deep background scoop on this is that this firm has gradually encouraged discussion of closing Miramar, but they will then push for a "rebaselined" environmental impact statement as the military cleans up the base. The "rebaselined" EIS will measure noise and traffic impact of a new airport not against MCAS Miramar during operations, but against MCAS Miramar during ZERO flight ops."

I just can't imagine people bitching about helo's. I love hearing a squadron of Apache's come near the house.

[El Gato]

Engines aren't supposed to wobble on their pylons, are they? :o)

Most do, especially the big fans they put on airliners these days. That's why they hide them under the wings, where most folks can't see them. :) It is kind of scary to watch I'll admit. Now the TF-33s, same basic enginer as the -135Es have, on the BUFF don't wobble much at all, and their two in each naccelle, for a total of eight altogether, Only airplane in the world that can shut down 5 engines and still be anything more than large glider with a very poor glide ratio. (The Ruskies do have a few 6 engine birds, AN-225s, but I doubt they fly very well on one engine) Even the BUFFs are currently under consideration for conversion to 4 large fan engines. They'd have more load carrying capability, (assuming one could find somewhere to carry additional load) and/or longer range, all with reduced fuel consumption. Congress will probably kill the notion though. The youngest one is only about 40 years old after all, but they are undergoing a mid-life upgrade at the moment. :)

[Poohbah]

The KC-135E's engines wobbled a LOT more than the ones on commercial 707s I flew.

[El Gato]

Well the base housing at Vandenberg AFB, is build on an impact zone from a WW-II era artillery range, back when it was Camp Cooke. I was told (in 1971), that every once and a while something "pops up". No KABOOMs, AFIAK.

[Live free or die]

You'll have to forgive my skepticism but in my opinion, this is 95% bunk. I don't know about the Air Force, Marine or Navy bases but I know from experience that Ft. Polk (the Joint Readiness Training Center), Ft. Sam Houston (where all the medics come from) Ft. Monroe (USAMRID and Germ Warfare Center) just to name 3 are all vital instalations. We lose them at our peril.

[Cautor]

Hate to tell you but this is bunk. The BRAC process is just getting under way and it will be quite a while before specific places get placed on anyone's list. Unlike the previous BRAC rounds (88, 91, 93, 95), this one looks like it will be driven top-down vice bottom-up, i.e. by OSD instead of individual services. The joint cross-service teams have been formed--as per the legal schedule Congress prescribed--but are just beginning to get serious about their work.</p>

[LibKill]

Marine Corps Recruit Depot San Diego, California (realign or close).

OUCH! That hurts.

Close I understand, what is meant by realignment?

[BOBWADE]

ping

[SLB]

You'll have to forgive my skepticism but in my opinion, this is 95% bunk. I don't know about the Air Force, Marine or Navy bases but I know from experience that Ft. Polk (the Joint Readiness Training Center), Ft. Sam Houston (where all the medics come from) Ft. Monroe (USAMRID and Germ Warfare Center) just to name 3 are all vital instalations.

Look at the logic:
Ft Polk - The JRTC remains, but with a fully devoted (maybe contract) OPFOR instead of a make-do use of the 2nd ACR.
Ft Sam Houston - This is a so what. Use the facilities at Walter Reed and Bethesda to train the medics. Always made sense to me. Where do the wounded from Iraq go? Walter Reed - it just makes sense.
Ft Monroe - Sorry you are all wet here. Ft Monroe is the home of TRADOC and that is about it. Turn it over to the National Park Service for the historical value.

Next?

[Ciexyz]

Redstone Arsenal is in Aniston AL, where I did basic training with the WAC in -- well, my younger days.

[Ciexyz]

Ft. Buchanan PR, that's where my cousin and his wife were stationed when I visited them in the early 90's. Bet the Commonwealth of PR and the puertoriquenos are screaming already.

[jimfree]

Many of these seem like good ideas. Naval Air Station Meridian has some sentimental value as I spent 4 years there in my first tour. But when we can economize, and we can economize, let's take the opportunity.

[SwankyC]

They wonjt close the Marine Corps recruit Depot in San Diego. It would serve no purpose since every building on the depot is registered as a historical building. They cant tear them down so what are they gonna do, spend twice the money they are now to fly/train all the recruits in Parris Island and maintain the entire depot with no recruits?

[dsc]

Hey, one question: if Tinker is so crowded now, how come the "downtown" area right outside the gate is so run down now? I was really shocked. The Skytrain Theater, the supermarket, Rexall Drugs, Nick's Restaurant, Langston's, Oklahoma Tire and Supply, both the jewelry stores, J.C. Penny's, TG&Y, Tubb Drug, the Chuckwagon, even the First National Bank--all gone!

It looks like Camden bloody New Jersey.

[SC Swamp Fox]

The Lima Tank Plant is, I think, the only tank production line that we have. I'll be surprised to see it close

I don't think that this means that the General-Dynamics Land Systems plant is closing, just the Army base that resides next to it.

[Not A Snowbird]

Poohbah,

I checked with my husband, who had to deal with these matters up to a year ago, and he confirmed we have fairy shrimp at Miramar. As well as numerous endangered plants and subspecies of who knows what, likely including Mesa Mint. He has a great story about having to tell the local community planning board that the FAA could not fix the Mission Bay Vortac because the Least Terns were nesting and couldn't be disturbed. The locals weren't the least bit pleased. One old lady told him to take all the cats out of the shelter and put them out there to "take care of" the birds... and she was "series".

[mbynack]

In addition to Groom Lake, there's the AF Fighter Weapons School and the RED FLAG ranges. It's the last range in the whole country where the Air Force can practice using some types of anti missile defenses.

Kirtland has the Navy Weapons Center, Monzano Nuclear Storage Area (A huge hollow mountain), Sandia Labs, and dozens of one of a kind test facilities that would have to be duplicated somewheres else.

[Live free or die]

Umm...what's with the attitude? In what have a given offence? Be nice.

For one thing, if they close Ft. Polk, JRTC goes 'bye-bye'. A "make-do" OPFOR? Sorry but those guys do an awesome job. Unless I'm mistaken we train doctors and nurses at hospitals like Walter Reed and Bathesda (which is Navy by the way) not combat medics. You might as well train infantrymen at a police academy! They're two different things altogether!

USAMRIID is in Ft Detrick (MD), I made a mistake be about 30 miles.

My point is if it ain't broke don't fix it!

[SLB]

My point is if it ain't broke don't fix it!

I agree, however the cost of doing business at locations that duplicate the effort is getting to be costly. With Rummy driving the train the name of the game will be tranformation not only in the way the military deploys and fights, but in the way we train.

This next statement is not going to go over with many, and I doubt it will come to being in our lifetime, but time will tell. The military as we know it, four seperate branches, will no longer exist. The branches will be combined and mixed into: Conventional Land fighters, Conventional Air Fighters (with certain specialties such as carrier operations or rotary wing attack operations), and Conventional Sea Fighters (the Navy). There will be a combined Special Operations force with their own land, air and sea forces.

[Severa]

*L* Same here. We live near NAS Oceana, where most of the Super Hornets are going to be based once the F14s are phased out (*whines at the loss of the F14s*) I say bring them all here.