Attack of the Killer Herc (AC-130 upgrades)

Jane's ^ | August 21 2003

[knighthawk]

Ping

[dighton]

Warm 'n' Fuzzy bump.

[Fee]

I hope these Pentagon jerks not only improve them, but build tons of them plus all the damn spare parts we can git. All these deployments are wearing these birds down.

[b4its2late]

Let's test it in Iraq on some of those roving terrorists that are going there to "play" with some of our troops.....

[pepsionice]

My guess is that it will take a crash of a AC-130 before the AF admits that the platform is being pushed to its limit. The funny thing...is that the company could just open up the front door and produce the same type plane today, with limited changes...1960s technology in this case is ok. Its what you tie onto the plane that makes a difference. If I were the AF...I'd put up a contract for 50 more of the birds. Our little wars over the globe are going to require a platform like the AC-130.

[ArrogantBustard]

. If I were the AF...I'd put up a contract for 50 more of the birds.

Then start working on weapons load for the AC-17...

[mbynack]

Then start working on weapons load for the AC-17...

Or possibly design a gunship platform from scratch instead of using cargo planes.

[grobdriver]

Then start working on weapons load for the AC-17...

Ahhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!
No!
Turbo props have their place. Low and slow is where.
The same knuckle-heads who want to replace the P-3 with pure jets would do this.
Newer is not always better.

[FreedomPoster]

I love getting a glipse of a P-3 every now and then. They appear around Dobbins every now and then, I guess when they're in for an engine overhaul.

[FreedomPoster]

/glipse/glimpse/

[ArrogantBustard]

Newer is not always better.

It's not 'newer' I have in mind, it's 'bigger'. If the C17 is too fast to do the job right, I'm no longer interested.

[grobdriver]

Or possibly design a gunship platform from scratch instead of using cargo planes.

If you designed the prefect airborne gun platform from scratch, it would wind up looking amazingly like the C-130. Consider:
1. Heavy load capability to carry lots of ammo (until we come up with killer lasers - and then they'll still have to haul some huge (hugh) generator).
2. Can carry lots of fuel for long loiter time.
3. Turbo prop engines to compromise effeciency at low altitude and high power output.
4. High wing so the gun ports have an unobstructed view of the ground.

[BlueLancer]

Hell from above...

[grobdriver]

Disregard the "nuckle-head" comment. No insult (towards you) intended.
:)
Speed is good going from place to place. Circling a fixed point on the ground while delivering armament is best done low and slow.
Turbo prop engines are basically run at 100% all the time and power is varied with prop pitch. When you gotta go (like in a SAM launch) you don't want to wait for the engines to spool up.... not that a heavy aircraft is going to accelerate very well anyway...
But you get the idea.

[mbynack]

You can't be series.;o)

No doubt that the AC-130 has been a great gunship. I'm just curious if they could design something that could be used in a higher AAA threat environment or during the day.

It would have been great to use the ACs for air cover during some of the aircrew rescue missions and during the daylight raids. It would have been ideal for taking out the enemy weapons that were placed near mosques and in villages if it was less susceptable to AAA fire.

Some of the factors that make it a great gunship are also liabilities, such as the slow airspeed and large size. The missiles are a good step toward giving it better standoff capability, but I wonder if they could develop a better way to launch them.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

RPGs kind of make Puff the Magic Dragon obsolite...

[ChadGore]

Puff the magic dragon . . . . .

[Blueflag]

C-130 is no longer 1960's technology.

the C-130J now in production is preety much an all new airplane.

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/factsheets/product8.html

[grobdriver]

Some of the factors that make it a great gunship are also liabilities, such as the slow airspeed and large size.

You got that right.
Don't know about missles for this mission. Maybe air launched RPVs which are themselves gunships.
Mount a minigun in an RPV, push it off the ramp, let it go in and shoot things up, retrieve the little bugger and go home.
Launch vehicle stays out of danger (and in this case could be a C-17 orbiting up high), the RPV is light enough so that the thrust-weight ratio provides the Gs to dodge SAMs - or, low radar cross section and correct IR suppresion might defeat SAMs altogether.
Swarm the ragheads with these things, and the command aircraft carries a squadron of pilots doing their thing remotely.
Hmmm... maybe I've been reading too much Dale Brown...