LBJ was behind JFK's assassination, upcoming book contends

Knight Ridder Newspapers ^ | Aug. 20, 2003 | HYE JEONG

[justshutupandtakeit]

Oswald followed political events and was well aware that Walker and JFK were deadly enemies and, in fact, the latter had fired the former over his remarks about foreign policy. There is zero evidence that LHO fired at Walker and plenty of evidence he did not. Walker never believed that he did and he claimed the bullet (which he recovered) was a 30.06 and NOT the bullet shown in the WC Report.

If I had the investigative resources of the Warren Commission providing evidence that Oswald did not kill the President alone would be rather simple. As it is very few Americans believed the Report recognizing it to be a cover up of the highest magnitude.

Of course, it wasn't Oswald at the car dealership THAT IS THE POINT. It WAS someone pretending to be him and trying to draw attention to himself.

Of course it wasn't Oswald at the firing range THAT IS THE POINT it was someone attempting to portray him as bizarre and goofy.

Of course, it wasn't Oswald at Sylvia Odio's THAT WAS THE POINT but it was someone introduced as him stressing his skills as a marksman and the fact he was an ex-marine. Ever stop to think that the reason she went bonkers the day of the assassination was BECAUSE she understood that she was standing on the edge of a volcano having been drawn into a plot to kill the president and introduced to a man pretending to be his alleged killer? Nah, that could not have anything to do with it must just be another freelance nut among the dozens around this horrid event.

Oswald's picture was not top secret and many people had access to it. His whole biography was available within hours of his capture. Even the CIA could read a newspaper. As regards the willingness of the CIA to help cover this up to avoid negative publicity. Even think a conspiracy might be WELL AWARE of such a tendency?

It is not clear that LHO fired from the TBD since the paraffin tests on his cheek never showed that he did. His identification as Tippett's killer only came after witnesses were: threatened, shot or killed. Then, viola, guess who gets identified?

Leaving the TBD after the killing is proof of nothing other than the fact he realized there would be no further work that day after such an event. In fact, it is easier to argue that his leaving is more the act of an innocent man than a guilty one since a guilty man would realize that leaving would draw attention to him while staying would help continue the cover. If that was fleeing perhaps the definition should be modified from "to run away....to withdraw abruptly, rush off..." to "sauter away casually as though one hasn't a care in the world." Never saw anyone FLEE on a CITY BUS. LOL.

Sure, the lack of evidence of Giancana's involvement must have been the reason the House Committee wanted his testimony. Government surveillance was sooo good that an assassin killed him RIGHT UNDER THEIR NOSES. Besides you don't know exactly WHAT J.Edgar was privey to wrt the taping.

There is a photo of the three tramps and, lo, one looks a hell of a lot like Mr. Harrelson.

The attempted rationalization of the shot from the front is nearly as laughable as the Magic Bullet. Not only is the evidence clear he was hit from the front but it was recognized immediately by the FBI which reversed the telling frames to change the backward movement of the head to a forward movement. Just another "mistake" by the Bureau? Additional proof is the fact that the brains were blasted OUT and AWAY from the car as is consistent with a front shot. Not DOWN and INTO the car as would have occurred from a rear shot from six stories up. The "neuromuscular response" is horsecrap through and through. The doctors who were on the ground said he was shot from the front.

Of course, it wasn't Oswald at the range THAT IS THE POINT.

[justshutupandtakeit]

That shows that a shot from the rear above would have filled the FLOOR of the car with brains, bone NOT blasted all over the cop BEHIND the car. And, no, they won't float magically in the air waiting for him to ride into them. Prairie dogs or no prairie dogs.

The card didn't move forward or backward. Its debris went AWAY from the direction of the shot and followed the bullet JUST LIKE JFK's brains did.

[Shooter 2.5]

As you can see in the side by side comparison, the debris follows the bullet. There is also the trace of material that went upward in the white spray[Brains are white, aren't they?] at the top of the head and white dots at the top of the card. I wouldn't want to drive through that mess even at eleven miles an hour. I'm still looking for a shot of an object with a hard exterior and soft interior.

[Tares]

Dr. WECHT: Based upon the findings in this case, it is my opinion that no bullet could have caused all these wounds, not only 399 but no other bullet that we know about or any fragment of any bullet that we know about in this case.

Dr. Wecht's opinion has been proven to be dead wrong. Neutron activation tests were performed to compare the fragments from Gov. Connally's wrist with CE 399. The conclusion of the tests was that the fragments in the Governor's wrist came from 399, and no other bullet.

Link

The link posted above is to the conclussion of an in-depth analysis of both the FBI and the HSCA tests. The conclusion links back to the supporting analysis, which includes deconstruction of various critiques of the test results.

[Shooter 2.5]

NCC = Neutron-Activation Analysis

WCC/MC = Winchester Cartridge Company/Mannlicher Carcano

Thanks for the link.

[Tares]

There is zero evidence that LHO fired at Walker

Wrong. The bullet was a Carcano bullet made by the same manufacturer as the bullets shot at Kennedy. Oswald's wife testified he tried to kill Gen Walker, and photos of the General's house were found among Oswald's possessions.

Of course, it wasn't Oswald at the car dealership...

It was, of course, though, an imposter, of course. The evidence is irrefutable, there is no way these could have been cases of mistaken identity. What evidence is there that these accounts are of imposters, and not cases of mistaken identity? Sylvia Odio never connected the name Oswald with her visitors until after the assassination, after her breakdown.

His identification as Tippett's killer only came after witnesses were: threatened, shot or killed. Then, viola, guess who gets identified?

Wrong. Numerous witnesses to Tippet's murder identified Oswald as the killer or as fleeing the scene in a line-up the night of the killings, within hours of the event.

Now some questions for consideration that have yet to be answered:

• Was Oswald's employment at the Depository a part of the conspiracy or not? Yes or no.

• If yes, were all the people who turned him down for a job in October in on the conspiracy? Were all the people who were involved in getting him the job at the Depository, including the supervisor that hired him, in on the conspiracy?

• If no, was Oswald in on the conspiracy, or was he an unknowing patsy?

• If he was an unknowing patsy, then how were the conspirators able to manipulate him into a job at the Depository without all the other potential employers, Ruth Paine, her neighbor, her neighbor's brother, and the supervisor that hired Oswald also being in on the conspiracy?

• If Oswald was an unknowing patsy, were the officers that supposedly planted the pistol on Oswald in on the plan to have a fellow police officer killed?

• If Oswald did not kill Tippet, then why did numerous eyewitnesses identify him from a line-up the same night? Were they all compromised by the conspirators?

[justshutupandtakeit]

There is no evidence that the bullet was from Oswald's gun so stop pretending there is. Walker said the bullet claimed to have been fired at him was NOT the bullet he dug out of his wall. El Switcheroo once again.

Marina's story has changed about almost everything once she was outside the FBI's control. Today she does not stand by what she said earlier or the belief that LHO was a killer or even would be killer.

Because the parties involved say so. Why in hell would Sylvia Odio know Oswald's name BEFORE it was released as JFK's killer? It is not like it was a household name, Duh. At any rate the name she was given was NOT Lee Harvey Oswald but some mixed up version, Harvey Lee or Lee.

One of the principle witnesses in the Tippett shooting was killed and another shot in the head but survived. One of the women had two men come to her home and threaten her if she did NOT id Ozzie.

Your questions imply some ability to get in the heads of the conspirators which I have never claimed. If I am questioning aspects of the WC case how does that give me the power to divine the answers to your question? Having a question or seeing flaws in the case as presented does not mean I can answer other questions.

It is not clear if LHO was working there for any reason than having to work. Was it part of the conspiracy to have his cheek not test positive for having fired a gun?

Witness accounts about the Tippett killing are confused at best and contradictory at worst. What is NOT confused is the FACT that different types of shells were found at the scene made by different companies at different times. Where did he get the ammo for either gun?

IF there was a conspiracy what makes you believe that JFK had to be killed near the TBD building? It is true that the route was tailor made for an assassination though a killer in LHO's alleged snipers nest would not have waited until the car was going AWAY from him only targetable through A TREE. He would have shot BEFORE then.

It appears that LHO was being manipulated (perhaps from the "defection" or before) and it is doubtful that he knew exactly WHO or WHAT he was working for or WHY he was making strange trips all over the place. We haven't even gotten into the strange aspects of his Louisiana sojourn (applying for jobs at the State Mental Hospital, registering to vote at ALL BLACK precients outside N.O.s, being identified by a violently rightwing ex-FBI man as "one of ours" to his secretary. What does all this mean?)

Why would you conclude that employers hiring a common laborer would have anything to do with a conspiracy? Minimal qualifications were all that were required.

I never claimed officers "planted" a pistol on LHO but that question is insignificant compared to the question of why DOZENS of officers arrived to arrest someone who had gone into a movie theatre without paying? It doesn't seem odd to you that his actions appear to be those of someone told to meet someone there?

There were very few witnesses to the Tippett killing and those who claimed something different from what was desired were threatened, shot or actually killed. Nor is it limited to the Tippett aspect of this case. That is not odd to you?

[justshutupandtakeit]

That is totally false. The Neutron analysis did NOT claim that the metal came from the same bullet only that it came from the RIFLE. And even that claim is doubtful at best.

In addition, I have never seen ANY claim that this test proved that it came from the same bullet at best it could be claimed that the metal came from the same batch of bullets.

[Tares]

There is no evidence that the bullet was from Oswald's gun so stop pretending there is. Walker said the bullet claimed to have been fired at him was NOT the bullet he dug out of his wall. El Switcheroo once again.

TESTIMONY OF MARINA OSWALD PORTER

Mr. McDONALD. Directing your attention to that day, April 10, 1963, would you tell us what happened?

Mrs. PORTER. Well, I cannot remember the timing all the very vivid details of day. I just can state it that that particular night he did not come home until very late, and when he did not come home at regular time, I was worried about him. So I found a note addressed to me what to do in case if he did not come home. Of course I was petrified. Nobody I can turn to. But then later that night when he came home, I asked him to explain. He was out of breath and he was pale, and asked him to explain this note, and he said that "I just shot General Walker." So I was very upset and enraged about that, and we had an argument over it.

Mr. McDONALD. Just a second, Mrs. Porter. Let's wait. [Air raid siren.]

Chairman STOKES. This reminds us of the customary test every Wednesday at 11 o'clock.

Mr. McDONALD. Just one minute.

Mrs. Porter, if you could speak up as best you can--

Mrs. PORTER. OK.

Mr. McDONALD [continuing]. So we can hear you. Before the siren, you were saying.---- Let me ask you the question so you can repeat the answer. What happened when Lee came home on the night of April 10, 1963?

Mrs. PORTER. He was very pale, as I said, and he was out of breath, and I was asking, I mean asked him to explain about the note that he left for me, and asked him what happened, and he said that he just tried to shoot General Walker. I asked him who General Walker was. I mean how dare you to go and claim somebody's life, and he said "Well, what would you say if somebody got rid of Hitler at the right time? So if you don't know about General Walker, how can you speak up on his behalf?." Because he told me that he wasn't--just a minute. He said he was something equal to what he called him a fascist. That was his description.

Mr. McDONALD. Did he turn on the television? Did he try to listen?

Mrs. PORTER. We did not have television. He turned the radio on later on, listened for the news, and it wasn't, nothing on.

Mr. McDONALD. You say he was pale?

Mrs. PORTER. Yes.

Mr. McDONALD. Did he appear nervous or distraught?

Mrs. PORTER. I don't know what "distraught" mean?

Mr. McDONALD. Well, other than being pale in color, did he give, did he have any other characteristics, physical characteristics? Did he seem to be shaking or extremely nervous?

Mrs. PORTER. Yes, he was extremely nervous; yes. Then when he heard the news that General Walker wasn't killed, you know, he was kind of angry that he missed it.

End of testimony excerp.

Was Marina Oswald in on the conspiracy? Yes or no.

[Tares]

That is totally false. The Neutron analysis did NOT claim that the metal came from the same bullet only that it came from the RIFLE. And even that claim is doubtful at best.

This paragraph exhibits total and complete ignorance of the nature and purpose the test, and of ballistics in general. The NAA test only deals with bullets and fragments, and has nothing to do with matching bullets to a rifle. Ballistic fingerprinting is what identifies a bullet with a rifle.

The claim that the fragments in the Governor's wrist came from CE 399 is solid. Rock solid. Anyone who read the link provided would not claim otherwise. Refute the evidence.

In addition, I have never seen ANY claim that this test proved that it came from the same bullet at best it could be claimed that the metal came from the same batch of bullets.

Read the link. The fragments not only came from the same batch of bullets, they came from the same bullet, 399, the one found on the strecher. The tests also prove that neither the fragments nor the bullet could have been switched or planted. Read the link.

[justshutupandtakeit]

Marina Oswald has utterly rejected the testimony she gave after being held by the government. Today she does not believe Oswald shot Kennedy or anyone else. One of her early stories was that she locked Lee in the bathroom so he wouldn't shoot NIXON.

In November, 1963 Marina was terrified, threatened with being sent back to Russia if she didn't "cooperate," she feared for her daughters, she feared for her life.

Why don't you reference the Marina of today and what she says?

[Tares]

In November, 1963 Marina was terrified, threatened with being sent back to Russia if she didn't "cooperate," she feared for her daughters, she feared for her life.

The testimony is from September 1978.

[justshutupandtakeit]

From your link (unknown source, unknown speaker but your link) "Every fragment recovered and tested came from Oswald's rifle (C2766) to the exclusion of all other rifles." So you are saying this author doesn't know what in hell he is talking about?

In addition, there are gratuitous comments without proof -#7, #8 and probably #6.

Every description of the Neutron Analysis which I have ever read makes no stronger claim than that the the fragments tested came from the same batch of bullets not the same bullet.

There have been many who critiqued these tests as being misleading at best and deceptive at worst. One certainty is that NONE of the fragments left in Connalley's body were tested. Thus, NO conclusions can be made as to whether they came from the same bullet as perhaps other fragments did.

[justshutupandtakeit]

Statements she made later indicate she does not believe her husband shot JFK. I saw an interview with her in the 1980s or 90s which completely contradicts earlier statements.

[Shooter 2.5]

It's almost impossible to match lead from one bullet to another even in the same lot. The lead pots used can have different heat, the lead can have a different level of antimony within the pot and lead can be added at different intervals. The lead used is not pure lead which is only used in Blackpowder guns. There's a mixture of Tin, Zinc, arsenic, Antimony, Chromium, Iron and 17 other lesser chemicals.

Add the chemical ingredients of the jacket and the odds become ridiculous.

It would be like creating two people with the same DNA.

If anyone disagrees with this, I would suggest they go to a gun website that deals with casting bullets and ask them if it's possible.

[cherry]

I did not read all 400+ posts so I hope I am not repeating....

but in the 1970's there actually was a movie IIRC about the assasination and it IIRC implied that it was LBJ and his cronies who arranged the assasination....

I think it was called "Execution" or " Executive order" or something similar.....

anybody recall that?

[Tares]

It's almost impossible to match lead from one bullet to another even in the same lot.

Read the body of the report on the NAA test. This issue is discussed in depth, very in depth.

[UCANSEE2]

First, I totally disagree that LBJ had anything to do with this.

The reason. I believe I know who did arrange for JFK to be killed, and I know the motive, and what else was arranged at that time.

Power, lust, and money. These are always at the base of evil acts.

WHO WANTED JFK killed? Well, think of what happened previous to his death.

Who is a member of Organized Crime, and one of the most powerful people in California and New YorK?, the most powerful in the entertainment industry? Who supports Democratic Presidents (and puts them in office)? Think, think, think.

[cherry]

"the quest for moral excellence"

we are talking Kennedy's here, and the concept of "moral excellance" associated with the Kennedy's is pretty far fetched.

[Tares]

From your link (unknown source, unknown speaker but your link) "Every fragment recovered and tested came from Oswald's rifle (C2766) to the exclusion of all other rifles." So you are saying this author doesn't know what in hell he is talking about?

In addition, there are gratuitous comments without proof -#7, #8 and probably #6.

The conclusions are based on combining the results of the various tests. The "gratutious" comments are backed up by about 120 pages of data and analysis.

Neutron-Activation Analysis and the John F. Kennedy Assassination