Men Behaving Badly - Why?

MND ^ | July 15, 2003 | Karl Glasson, Ph.D.

[Feldkurat_Katz]

You are correct that a guy can have enjoyable sex with a woman that he is not emotionally connected to (else prostitution would not be the worlds oldest profession), so one option available to high-status men who have had all the kids they're interested in having, is to get a vasectomy and then have a succession of girlfriends (keeping no individual one around long enough to qualify for "palimony")

This may work for low or middle-status men as well and in the worst case they can always use prostitutes, it's still cheaper than child support.

[Feldkurat_Katz]

But no solution consisting of turning back the "clock" (i.e getting rid of no fault divorce, dismantling the "social security" net of direct wealth transfer from young to old and men to women, etc) is on the horizon, given the opposing distribution of power amongst academia, media, govt beauracracy, etc. IMO they will tinker around the edges and never get to the root of the problem. And then things will get really, really bad . IMO.

I am not sure where things are heading on the government side, but the simple law of supply and demand tells me that the shortage of marriage-minded men may give men an opportunity to dictate the price (provided they are smart enough to recognize the opportunity.) Also, we may see even more cohabitation.

[Nonstatist]

the shortage of marriage-minded men may give men an opportunity to dictate the price (provided they are smart enough to recognize the opportunity.)

But isn't the Law, the Law? Once he has offspring with someone, he's still screwed if she bails out. Maybe he gets to shop around more and has more choice, but the gov't is not on his side.

Also, we may see even more cohabitation.

I agree, but how does that help either partner, aside from avoiding taxes? He is still responsible for the offspring, in the same way. Actually, he has less rights in custody proceedings (if less were possible)

[Cogadh na Sith]

I need to find me a 'sugar-momma'.

A hot older lady (early-mid 40's) with lots of her previous husband's money who will use me for cheap sex, likes guns, and takes me on cool vacations where there are golf courses.

My end of the bargain is wild booty-slapping sex, looking good on her arm, not saying anything dumb to friends she is trying to impress, helping her spend her ex's money and being both charming and delightful.

[Feldkurat_Katz]

the shortage of marriage-minded men may give men an opportunity to dictate the price (provided they are smart enough to recognize the opportunity.)

But isn't the Law, the Law? Once he has offspring with someone, he's still screwed if she bails out. Maybe he gets to shop around more and has more choice, but the gov't is not on his side.

You are mostly right, but the law of supply and demand means that men can make demands prior to getting married, such as requiring a prenuptial agreement, requiring that the prospective spouse be debt-free etc.

Also, we may see even more cohabitation.

I agree, but how does that help either partner, aside from avoiding taxes? He is still responsible for the offspring, in the same way. Actually, he has less rights in custody proceedings (if less were possible)

There still may be child support but there usually is no alimony and no division of property. Far from ideal, but better than marriage.

Other things may happen. We may see more men becoming self-employed/incorporated in order to obfuscate the financial picture. We may see men emigrate in order to escape child support (actually, I'm surprised it's not happening yet, at least not on a large scale.)

[Nonstatist]

the law of supply and demand means that men can make demands prior to getting married, such as requiring a prenuptial agreement, requiring that the prospective spouse be debt-free etc.

A pre-nup doesnt get you out of the child support leg irons. Remember, child support payments now are about equal to what child support plus alimony used to be 30 yrs ago, as a percentage of your salary.

Also, we may see even more cohabitation. ...There still may be child support but there usually is no alimony and no division of property. Far from ideal, but better than marriage.

But how about property aquired after cohabitation began? I'm not sure he gets to keep all that. But as I mentioned above, alimony is not the big problem (most women work or remarry, etc) as much as child support is, which can absolutely strangle a guy. If you marry and divorce before having kids, its not that bad a financial problem. .. You might see more childless couples, of course....

Other things may happen. We may see more men becoming self-employed/incorporated in order to obfuscate the financial picture. We may see men emigrate in order to escape child support (actually, I'm surprised it's not happening yet, at least not on a large scale.)

The latter, for sure, if there was somewhere the guy without a lot of money could go. More than a few men change their identity and slip off to Mexico and Canada; often with their kids, illegally.

Again, all these things mentioned are destructive to society as a whole.

[Nick Danger]

IMO they will tinker around the edges and never get to the root of the problem. And then things will get really, really bad.

I agree with that. There are some natural processes that are sinusoidal... business cycles, the see-sawing populations of wolves and rabbits, etc. This does not look like one of those to me. People say, "the pendulum must swing back," but it might not be a pendulum at all.

Nature uses a whole bunch of processes that are episodic and catastrophic: forest fires, asteroid strikes, etc., where basically everything gets reset to zero quickly, and then the building process starts over again. These phenomena are "cyclical," but the waveforms are more like a sawtooth than a sine wave. This could be one of those. I hope it's one of those. In that one we have some kind of economic/political implosion that looks like Very Hard Times to the people going through it, but it is not the end.

There is another kind of process that can also look like this, but the sawtooth drop does mark the end; there is no next cycle. Disease organisms are like that... they go into runaway "success," but what is success to them is death to their host organism, whose death ends the game for them as well. If Western Civilization can't keep its geography populated, the "success" of the people who made that happen will end with the same big thud. I don't think Gay Pride Day appears in Qu'ran, and neither do female-friendly divorce courts.

[SauronOfMordor]

A hot older lady (early-mid 40's) with lots of her previous husband's money who will use me for cheap sex, likes guns, and takes me on cool vacations where there are golf courses.

Such gigs are hard to find. A guy I know gets into them occasionally -- he's in construction, in good shape (or, he was. Age catches up with us all), etc. The relationships don't last.

The problem is that the situation is asymmetrical. Guys go for looks, girls go for status, and a guy that you are supporting is just not high-status to your friends.

[Feldkurat_Katz]

I agree with most of what you wrote. I was writing with the intention of describing how men may try to make the most of the lousy cards we are dealt and I am very well aware that making a disease less painful is no substitute for curing it.

By the way, I am a divorced father and I do not pay child support, thanks to the joint custody.

[Kevin Curry]

Traditional families are becoming extinct, 20 million children have been violently tortured and murdered in their mothers' wombs since 1973, gangs of rootless young men roam through inner cities wreaking murder and mayhem, Lady Hillary McBeth is touted as our next feminist oberfuhrer, . . .

But all in all, life is splendid . . . simply splendid!

[najida]

Where do I send the application? ;)

[Kevin Curry]

What a shallow, hollow, and pathetic life you aspire to.

The bank account of your common sense is diwndling to its last few tacky pennies.

[SauronOfMordor]

You are mostly right, but the law of supply and demand means that men can make demands prior to getting married, such as requiring a prenuptial agreement, requiring that the prospective spouse be debt-free etc.

This assumes that the prenup gets enforced. The courts may decide to enforce it, or may disregard it as "against public policy". See here. Also, provisions regarding child support are prohibited (see here) and any prenup which would "provide a standard of living far below that which was enjoyed before the marriage" will also be unenforcable (see prior link). Also, it may be cancelled if one party "signed under duress" (here), where "duress" may be found to include "sign this or I won't marry you"

Bottom line: a prenup may not be enforcible against her, but certainly WILL be enforced against YOU)

[Nonstatist]

By the way, I am a divorced father and I do not pay child support, thanks to the joint custody.

I commiserate, and as far as your kids go ,you are fairly lucky, IMO.. My best friend got dumped by his ex-wife and now pays well over 40 % of his gross in child support alone. He lives in a tiny walk-up in NYC while his wife and kids have a nice big apt on the Upper East Side. He was pretty near suicidal after it first happened; he certainly is not the same person he was 10 yrs ago, in many ways. And he can barely influence his kids' upbringing, either. Very sad.

[Darksheare]

The point you make, and prove by your very words and actions, is that women have been conditioned and trained to be light in their thinking and act without thinking.
Your words sound more like a liberal's than a conservative's.

Besides, if I constantly denigrated you and insulted you, wouldn't YOU have a reason to be upset about it?
I held open a door for two esteemed young brainwashed examples of today's young women.
They screamed that I was sexually harrassing them merely by HOLDING THE DOOR OPEN for them.
So I slammed it in their whining snotty nosed faces.
Which they deserved.
IF you enjoy polite society, then you should thank traditional values instead of feminism.
Traditional feminism brought you nothing more than the lie that sex without rules and regrets is fine, and that dressing like a prostitute doesn't make you one.

[Cogadh na Sith]

What a shallow, hollow, and pathetic life you aspire to.

As opposed to what? My 'nice Christian Ex' spent all our savings on crap, tarot reading and vice and then called the cops on me when I complained....

The bank account of your common sense is diwndling to its last few tacky pennies.

That is the most tortured metaphor I have ever seen. It's dwindling along with my actual bank account 'cuz I initially believed in marriage and life-long bonding and got scroooooooooood by the law like so, so many other men..... Which is the point of this article, dope.

[Cogadh na Sith]

Freep mail me and I will send you a handsome picture of me--playing the bagpipe wearing my family tartan kilt.

Eat yer heart out SauronofMordor.... :)

[Darksheare]

I had a similar experience myself.
I made the mistake of holding a door open for two of the brainwashed examples of what passes for today's feminine youth.
They screamed that I was sexually harrassing them.
So I slammed the door on them.
If they don't appreciate polite society, then they do not deserve to experience it, nor enjoy it's benefits.

[Darksheare]

"I suggest learning to better hide your poisonous hostility towards women."

What about your poisonous hostility towards men?

[ricpic]

It's duh end a' duh woild I tellya, duh end a' duh woild!