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Astronomers find 'home from home' - 90 light years away!
spaceref.com ^ | 3 Jul 03 | staff

Posted on 07/03/2003 10:22:13 AM PDT by RightWhale

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To: ALS
1969. Men walked on the Moon. And several times thereafter.

BTW. That's not a cheap shot. It illustrates a point.

161 posted on 07/03/2003 5:26:43 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: RightWhale
New solar system like ours but 90 lightyears away.

Isn't that the distance in Star Trek to that resort planet, Risa or whatever?

162 posted on 07/03/2003 5:27:08 PM PDT by JoeSchem (Okay, now it works: Knight's Quest, at http://www.geocities.com/engineerzero)
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To: e_engineer
Why 0.3 eccentricity? Is it favored by the detection method?

The range is from 0.0 to 0.92 or so, but there seem to be a number around 0.3. Somebody could chart the data if they are interested. Systematic effects was my first thought. There are a variety of methods for detection, perhaps some favor particular results. It's a valid question.

163 posted on 07/03/2003 5:27:39 PM PDT by RightWhale (gazing at shadows)
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To: Prodigal Son
Like I said, your definition was not forthcoming.

predictable child's play
164 posted on 07/03/2003 5:31:11 PM PDT by ALS ("this is a book which contains the basis of natural history for our views" Marx on Origin of Species)
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To: Prodigal Son
biology is a mere subset of the truth

It's a level of complexity. There is lower complexity--chemicals and rock, and there is higher complexity--behavior and society. The laws of physics operate on the very lowest levels and on every level all the way up in some manner. It's not going to

165 posted on 07/03/2003 5:33:50 PM PDT by RightWhale (gazing at shadows)
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To: DannyTN
Ok, but how fast can we reasonably travel? How long would it take us to go 90 lightyears?

With current technology -- warp drives need not apply -- we could build a giant rocket that is propelled by hydrogen bomb detonations behind a pusher plate. This concept was actually researched by the government in the 1950s and 60s and showed promised for interstellar flight (though it couldn't be operated within a million miles of Earth, and we've yet to travel a million miles from Earth, so it still isn't practical . . . but it is possible).

Anyhow, maximum speed for nuclear pulse was three percent light speed. Thus it would take three thousand years to travel ninety light years.

A multi-generational city-sized space ark would be appropriate.

166 posted on 07/03/2003 5:33:58 PM PDT by JoeSchem (Okay, now it works: Knight's Quest, at http://www.geocities.com/engineerzero)
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To: JoeSchem
A multi-generational city-sized space ark would be appropriate.

That's going to take significant time to build even before the expedition sets out. We better start today.

167 posted on 07/03/2003 5:39:10 PM PDT by RightWhale (gazing at shadows)
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To: Lawgvr1955
controversy whether the speed of light has remained constant throughout time

That would sure louse up Einstein's equation E=mc2 showing energy corresponding to a mass "m" at rest. "c" is the speed of light. "E" is the total energy of a freely moving particle. If mass disappears (like in a nuclear reaction) the equivalent energy must appear. If light speed changes, so do nuclear reactions. Stars run on nuclear fusion. This presents a problem...if the speed of light were slower in the past, fusion would have been less energetic. Stars might not have even gotten "started".

All this presents a conundrum, unless Einstein's theory is seriously flawed. It has held up so far under many years of rigorous high-energy physics tests.

168 posted on 07/03/2003 5:40:06 PM PDT by petuniasevan (Visit the Astronomy Picture of the Day and learn about the exciting universe!)
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To: ALS
Like I said, your definition was not forthcoming.

What part of intelligent life did you not get? That was my definition.

The point is, we are here. We are in the universe. We are definitely not confined to this little orb on which we find ourselves. Given enough time, life will be spread all throughout the galaxy (if not the universe) simply because that's the way we are. So while your position might be true in the here and now- it is demonstrably not going to be true forever. So it isn't a reliable position around which to build a belief system.

Second. Regardless of whether you believe in creation or evolution, it is a perfectly rational conclusion at which to arrive to assume that there is more life out there somewhere. If evolution is a natural occurance, it would be more surprising that it didn't happen in other places (given the unfathomable size of the universe) than to learn that it did. Likewise, if we were created by a higher intelligence (aside from the fact that its existence would constitute life outside the confines of Earth) it would be totally natural to assume this creator fostered life elsewhere. It's not to say that assumption would be correct- but it would be totally rational to assume he/she/it did.

Given the vast scope of the universe, life elsewhere in it is a sure bet. If you're playing the odds, life is where you put your money.

169 posted on 07/03/2003 5:42:16 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: petuniasevan
Thanks for that data sheet. The news media just mentions a couple of numbers and apparently considers that good enough for the masses. As usual, it seems we can't view the celestial object from Fairbanks.
170 posted on 07/03/2003 5:42:24 PM PDT by RightWhale (gazing at shadows)
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To: KevinDavis
... is that the gas giants tend to act as shields say from killer asteriods (like Jupiter did in 1994 with Shoemaker Levy comet. We would not be here if the comet hit this planet.), or sometimes it could kill a planet depending on the orbit.

Yes; Jupiter-like planets in a Jupiter-like orbits are like "Hoover's" of the solar system, vacuuming up all the detritus that could end life as we know it on Earth.

So essentially, they are thought of as being a necessary condition for life to form and flourish on an Earth-like planet.

171 posted on 07/03/2003 5:43:02 PM PDT by longshadow
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To: RightWhale
It's not going to

You left something off there?

At any rate:

The laws of physics operate on the very lowest levels and on every level all the way up in some manner.

With you totally there.

172 posted on 07/03/2003 5:44:29 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: Prodigal Son
"Regardless of whether you believe in creation or evolution, it is a perfectly rational conclusion at which to arrive to assume that there is more life out there somewhere."

Hypothesis, assumption, speculation, maybe.
Conclusion? Hardly.

173 posted on 07/03/2003 5:46:00 PM PDT by ALS ("this is a book which contains the basis of natural history for our views" Marx on Origin of Species)
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To: ALS
Conclusion? Hardly.

Oh yeah. It is my conclusion that there is life out there. Like it or not.

174 posted on 07/03/2003 5:47:11 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: Prodigal Son
You left something off there?

Apparently. Was interrupted by the real world and simply sent without editing.

175 posted on 07/03/2003 5:48:17 PM PDT by RightWhale (gazing at shadows)
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Comment #176 Removed by Moderator

To: RightWhale
These things happen ;-)
177 posted on 07/03/2003 5:48:54 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: Prodigal Son
finally
178 posted on 07/03/2003 5:50:19 PM PDT by ALS ("this is a book which contains the basis of natural history for our views" Marx on Origin of Species)
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To: ALS
finally what?
179 posted on 07/03/2003 5:51:14 PM PDT by Prodigal Son
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To: RightWhale
Multigenerational ships may be the only way to go.

When you accelerate a body to relativistic speeds, you come upon some real problems. First, you are blue-shifting all background and stellar radiation into the high-energy realm. Somehow one must shield the delicate life-forms aboard from this constant blizzard of gamma and x-rays.

Second, if any matter is in the path of the craft, how will the craft avoid it? Almost as soon as its photons arrive to announce its presence the object itself will be hot on the heels of the "message".

Third, time will shorten considerably (depending on how close to c the craft accelerates). 6 months' ship travel time to HD70642 at 99.9% c still will be 90+ years here on Earth. Friends and relatives of the astronauts will be long gone when they return.

Sure, I prefer the physics of Star Trek, but I don't think it's practical; it may not even be possible.

180 posted on 07/03/2003 5:52:48 PM PDT by petuniasevan (Visit the Astronomy Picture of the Day and learn about the exciting universe!)
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