Posted on 03/12/2003 9:37:11 PM PST by TLBSHOW
penny-wise, pound foolish..
O'Keefe was asked about Ron Dittemore's statement about nothing could've been done to save Columbia, he categorically rejected that statement:
From an article at spaceref:
When asked about something Ron Dittemore repeatedly said in post-accident briefings with regard to options which could have been exercised i.e. that 'nothing we could be done anyway' O'Keefe said "with all due respect, Ron Dittemore is not speaking for the agency in this regard. I fundamentally - absolutely - reject the proposition that there was nothing that could have been done on-orbit. The context within which he stated that has an entirely different meaning than what has been attributed to him. There isn't anybody here at this agency that, had there been a strong indication that [something was wrong], wouldn't have looked at the scenarios, the contingencies to see how applicable any of these might have been. [There is] no doubt in my mind whatsoever. Given the history of this agency there is nothing - we would have spared no effort to avoid a catastrophe. Every incident you can think of will never be covered by every scenario or every simulation that you can run. But to suggest that we would have done NOTHING!? at all is positively fallacious. If there would have been any indication at all that would have driven us to the point – and I am not talking about 'what if' scenarios - but rather a clear indication that says 'here is some apparent damage, or something that is causing an operational deficiency, there would have been no end to the efforts to try and figure out [what could be done]."
At this point O'Keefe started to get a little angry "Apollo 13 - think about the circumstances there. There was no International Space station to rendezvous with. There was no other capsule up there. There was nothing on the pad that could have gone up to retrieve them. So I am sure there could have been a lot [of people saying] at that juncture - 'Oh well, I guess there's not much we can do'. But that is not what happened. In a situation like this you have to look at what you have available. Was this [the cause of the Apollo 13 accident] in anyone's scenario or simulation? No. This was not a story that someone cooked up - this really happened. There are folks walking around - alive - today telling that story because they lived it - not because they wrote about it on some beach weekend. This really did happen."
O'Keefe went on to say "in looking to save these people (Columbia's crew), had there been an option, this would have been the 'core responsibility - 24/7 - to try and find some solution. I just fundamentally, absolutely - categorically - reject the proposition that nothing would have been done - or that nothing could have been done."
NASA Walks the Gauntlet: Sean O'Keefe Does Brunch With the Press (Part 1)
Whether it would have ended up helping or not, they should have gone ahead and done it anyway.
I'm no expert, certainly, but I see three possible viewings of the tiles:
Thanks for the ping, Mike, and a ping back.
[If you want off or on my Columbia ping list, let me know. FReegards.]
see three possible
see four possible
Mr. Hartsfield said someone at NASA did make an early request for imagery to the Defense Department. But he said that request, which "was not coordinated with the rest of the flight operations world," was withdrawn by another NASA official, Roger D. Simpson.SIMPSON should be fired for misfeasance and endangering incompetence and his pension voided. HARTSFIELD should be demoted and assigned a non-visibility, clerical job -- he leads falsely in arrogance of explanation when utter humility is required![The] e-mail message was released last month by NASA, [] Mr. Simpson on Jan. 23 []thanked officials at the United States Strategic Command for considering a request to observe the Columbia for damage but criticized the request as not having gone through proper channels.
Mr. Simpson apologized for any "inconvenience the cancellation of the request may have caused" and said that it had served only to "spin the community up about potential problems." He added that the shuttle was "in excellent shape."
* * * * *
On a side note there were a few quick-to-be-knowledgable "expert" Freepers who made FALSE and RIDICULOUS claims that our satellite imaging capability was not up to taking adequate photos of the shuttle. Where ARE these *experts* today? Where is their willingness to admit misstatement or even to give *some* explanation of why they were so forward with statements posted as knowledgable facts that now appear too be all fantasty and pull-out-of-tuckus blarney?
Basically, their intent is to dismiss im-moderation; they're in the job to attenuate, to not make waves, and to dampen, or eliminate altogether, any thing and anybody making waves.
In hi-tech. project operations and development, the work of failure analysis and applied science naturally includes finding out what makes waves --- but for the purpose of learning what opposes us as a challenge to be overcome.
Thus, the terminology of the business, can be used by both the moderators and the applied scientists, but to two different ends.
The moderators are most expert at sounding like they are applied scientists, as they work to attenuate discovery and minimize expensive, actual technical achievement.
While the applied scientists work for the truth, emboldened by the challenges to improve our lot; in other words, to an honest day's work for an honest day's pay; learn and fix.
Instead of "the fix" which is so ingrained and telling, the course of the "work" [not] done by the management.
God Bless our brave men and women, and please forgive us, our moderators.
NTSB says could have been inattention, engine failure, etc...Angle of the sun could factor in...
Typical. Gov't manager's first effort, is to moderate, attenuate, dismiss.
Rick Rescorla (see the movie, We Were Soldierrs Once ... and Young), later in the early morning of September 11, 2001, died in the WTC while helping people out of the complex; he was the security manager for Morgan Stanley.
But when he first made contact with the New York Port Authority, immediately after the first aircraft's plunge through the first tower struck, he was astonished to hear them say that it wasn't anything and to sit tight ... no need to panic:
See James B. Stewart's article, "The Real Heroes Are Dead," Feb. 11, 2002, The New Yorker.
Because of [his long-time friend] Hill's training in counterterrorism, in 1990 Rescorla asked him to come up and take a look at the security situation. "He knew I could be an evil-minded bastard," Hill recalls. At the World Trade Center, Rescorla asked him a simple question: "How would you take this out?" Hill looked around, and asked to see the basement. They walked down an entrance ramp into a parking garage; there was no visible security, and no one stopped them. "This is a soft touch," Hill said, pointing to a load-bearing column easily accessible in the middle of the space. "I'd drive a truck full of explosives in here, walk out, and light it off."As a result of Hill's observations and his own, Rescorla arranged a meeting with a security official for the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, which managed the building. "They told Rick to kiss off," Hill recalled. "They told him, 'You lease your stories, you worry about that. The rest of the building is not your concern.' " (A Port Authority spokesman says that security "took into account all known threats at that time," and "was better than in most office buildings in New York.")
. . .
[On Sept. 11, 2001] Hill could hear Rescorla issuing orders through the bullhorn. He was calm and collected, never raising his voice. Then Hill heard him break into song:
Men of Cornwall stop your dreaming;
Can't you see their spearpoints gleaming?
See their warriors' pennants streaming
To this battlefield.
Men of Cornwall stand ye steady;
It cannot be ever said ye
for the battle were not ready;
Stand and never yield!Rescorla came back on the phone. "Pack a bag and get up here," he said. "You can be my consultant again." He added that the Port Authority was telling him not to evacuate and to order people to stay at their desks.
"What'd you say?" Hill asked.
"I said, 'Piss off, you son of a bitch,' " Rescorla replied. "Everything above where that plane hit is going to collapse, and it's going to take the whole building with it.
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