Illegal immigrants Leaving Mounds of Trash on Tohono O'Odham Indian Sacred Lands

tucson tv ^ | 11/27/02 | Paul Cicala

[jmax]

"I don't know how much you know about Mexican immigrants. I would guess it isn't much. I used to live in the Salinas Valley in California. I know a lot about them."

"It would not be unusual for me to get up on a Sunday and drive my wife and kids down for breakfast on Cannery Row. There's a place down there that has a good buffet. I could have a Ramos Fiz. Or maybe two. Watch the otters, and the yuppies in their kayaks."

Gee, Harry, I guess if I had a Ramos Fiz and watched "otters and yuppies in their Kayaks" I'd be able to claim to be an immigration expert, also.

//sarcasiam

[willyone]

Immigrants? These are illegals therefore criminals from day one. When they displace your sensitive ass you may wake up. This is not like in the past where assimilation was expected and the flow stopped for a period of time. This never stops and goofs like you think it is fine and also approve of their not wanting to become assimilated. You must like being a sucker and walking ATM machine.

[willyone]

So how many Mexicans do you know? You seem to have the noble savage mindset of most liberals. You need to get off your knees for a while and see what is going on. The net cost of these people far exceeds any taxes they pay.

[willyone]

And you are an a-hole. So enough with the simplistic name calling. Mexicans are doing these jobs because they have driven the wages so low that no American can afford to do them. I was in Wash. state last month and the area I was in all the menial jobs were done by Americans. So much for your theory of no one else being willing to do them. And I doubt if you are smart enough to pick strawberries. That you Dean?

[willyone]

Before the new border fence went up in San Diego they used to line up by the hundreds on an area known as the soccer field. Went it got dark they would rush the border. While this was going on they were also coming across in other areas. You have no idea how bad it was unless you lived in South San Diego near the border. People running through yards all night long. Now it has shifted to East county where it is truly a Wild West movie set.

[Terridan]

The small tax they pay doesn't begin to cover the free medical, dental services they recieve, not to mention the bankrupting of our hospitals and schools... free breakfast and lunch programs, shall I go on? We are losing our hospital, and the librals blame it on our senior citizens, who, by the way can pay for services! No mention of the thousands of births and surgeries preformed "gratis" or the non-reimbursment amounts!

[Thud]

Make 'em file an environmental impact report.

[Terridan]

OOPS! I forgot to add, the thousands of hit and runs and damages incurred by illegals... my self, I've been hit twice, which is why I now drive a 4WD suburban. Insurance only pays if you can prove the assailant was an uninsured driver... go figure... but now, I can run them over and hold them for the police ;)

[jokar]

Nor will it win you the next election.....

The old political power at any price mantra. Without much thought about the unintended consequences. I notice you've left the state to.

You need to read Michelle Malkins book. With all due respect, every one of your ignorant and misguided arguments have been thoroughly refuted.
.They get paid under the table in cash for the most part.
.They drive the prevailing wages down.
.They have so saturated the work market, that in order to be a day laborer, or construction worker, you have to speak Spanish in order to work. Why would I hire you as a foreman or laborer, if you can't communicate with the crew ?
.In many cases they don't earn enough to pay taxes. When they do have withholding taken out, (how do you do that with no ssn) they in fact receive back most or all the money they paid in.

.Many live two and three families to houses or small apartments. In Santa Cruz I've seen signs in Spanish telling the families not to cook indoors, with their traditional charcoal stoves. This occurs within 5 miles of my nice middle class home. This drives down our property values.

. The money they send home (about 30% of the Mexican GNP) does not leave much for property improvement.

They drove my father out of our childhood home. Due to the tendency towards turning the yards into third world aromatic barnyards, raising goats, chickens and surly dogs. Using the front yard to run impromptu clotheslines from the tree the fence really helped the sale. He was counting on the sale of his home for at least some of his retirement income. He didn't even break even.

PETA heads up .... these guys also love to hold cock fights. With the drinking, gambling, music, cars etc. quite the fiesta atmosphere.

They apply for and receive food stamps and other very expensive "Health & Social Services" paid for by the local and federal taxpayers by simply uttering the magic words "I intend to remain in the United States". They are often coached by misguided social service providers to say these words and then, they can't be quizzed about their residency status.

It is the policy of most socialist service agencies is to seek out and provide services to these deprived "communities".

These are not just emergency room visits to the Dr. for sick baby's. These are long-term medical care for children that have very serious medical problems.

For example, California Children Services (CCS) provides wheelchairs, crutches, medical equipment Orthopedic devices and anything else related to crippling diseases for children. This includes the training for the family and/or care takers of the child. Free.

These services includes transportation cost which are reimbursable by check to the parents or caretakers. Many times this involves traveling from far reaching communities in the desert like Thermal to Loma Linda (a major hospital). If the parents don't have transportation they will pay for bus, medical transport etc. Cost covered also includes overnight accommodation vouchers so the person traveling with the child can have a motel and food.

CCS will also pay for social worker time and training from other health fields such as Occupational Therapist Physical Therapist and Respiratory Therapist to train and monitor the families proper use of the Physician prescribed devices. Counseling can include the education of the parents/caretakers to the importance following through with appointments how to access services and home visits to make sure all is going well.

I know there are cases where the parents received money to take a respite weekends off. This meant paying for the homecare worker to come in and provide substitute care. This can be another neighbor or family member. This is done when it is deemed that the child may need to have the primary caregivers take a break so they can better deal with and provide for the child over the long-term.

When you also take into consideration the cost to administrate these services from both the state and hospital perspective, that is a handsome chunk of change.

When news of this largesse travels to Mexico, and it does, is it any wonder that they make the trip.

As to your measly votes,
it is registered Democrats appartiks and Socialist activists that by and large deliver the services and become the first point of contact for these soon to be Democrat votes. The Socialist are always winning the hearts and souls of the downtrodden with your money. These are the same misguided "touchy feely people" who rail that America is not doing enough and in their eyes, we'll never do enough.

You and the so called Conservatives who won't address the root problem of closing off the southern border are just so wrong. And frankly you are just as bad for America as any of them.

By the way my wife is first generation Argentine immigrant. Her parents are social liberals due to their Christian background. They and other LEGAL immigrants will understand and help to address the problem when we frame it properly. They want something done about the flood of illegal's. They paid a price for their citizenship, we need to reinforce that message. The conservatives just have to have the cajones and backbone to address the problem by speaking the truth.

As to the democrats, let frame this problem any way they want. We already know they have no valid argument and can't even stay on topic long enough to present an argument to it's logical conclusion. If we believe that our argument is true and valid, then treat the democrats and race baiters like howling children in a supermarket, they will shortly give up and go on to something else.

I believe that it would be helpful if Hugh Hewitt other broadcast and conservative intellectuals would quit pretending that the proverbial elephant is not in the living room. When he has Dave Dryer and other conservative politicians appearing on his program and they ignore this problem or downplay it's importance to callers. They apparently think the hard feelings towards illegal's will somehow magically go away. This is not the case. The illegal's will take up the same resources and create the same social dilemmas whether they have received amnesty or not.

My own congressman Lewis sent out a pre-election survey of the four most important issues for this election. Immigration was conspicuous by it's absence. The long term future of the party lies in what we do best, telling the truth, not pandering.

[Hal.009]

"Tribal leaders are asking the federal, state and county governments to get involved. However, Ramon says it's an uphill battle."

The reason for this uphill battle is the tribes have fought to gain special rights for themselves years. Special rights not afforded to the rest of the citizens include tribal Casinos, harvesting game out of season (allowed for personal consumption but some members of the tribes shoot deer and harvest salmon in gill nets and sell the products to resturants).In Alaska, only the native (not native born) eskimoos may harvest whales or raise reindeer.

Since the tribes insist upon their own police force and their own set of laws, it is only fair the tribes pay for any additional security to guard their borders.

They can easily do this with just a small portion of the profits raised from the tribal Casinos, and the latest scam of selling low priced cigarettes mail order shipped anywhere in America, a "right" forbidden to the rest of us "citizens".

In all fairness, the indians did a lot more than "trash the place" when they were the ones crossing the borders to raid Mexico.

[rdb3]

Not quite sure why I was pinged to this, but anyhoo...

You and the so called Conservatives who won't address the root problem of closing off the southern border are just so wrong. And frankly you are just as bad for America as any of them.

Meaningless hyperbole here. It's more emoting than anything substantive.

Also, you didn't address the real problem in your post, either. It has nothing to do with the physical border in and of itself. The real reason why we have so many illegal Mexican immigrants is "ease of employment," or, to put it more succinctly, incentive.

So we know the "who," "what," "when," "how," and "where" of the problem, but it seems no one wants to raise the most important question; Why?

They come here to work. Now, why is it that they (who are illegal) have such an easy time gaining employment in America?

That's the problem. We knock the heads of those who hire illegals and your problem will vanish almost overnight. I'm talking about unbearably punitive fines and serious prison sentencing for those found guilty. As far as social services are concerned, I believe stemming the influx first will free up the necessary time to purge remaining illegals off of the dole.

There shall be no mercy.
101 things that the Mozilla browser can do that Internet Explorer cannot.

[Enemy Of The State]

Thankfully Im no longer residing in the Peoples Republic of California. Im sure the figure of 1,500 isn't just for California alone. That figure probably represents the entire Mexican border, at least I would think so.

[A_perfect_lady]

Oh, you'd better not mess with The Other Harry... he knows all about Mexicans. He's had LUNCH there, don't you know. LOL!!

[gaspar]

First, the Tohono O'Odham (formerly Pima) Indians should spend a percentage of their casino profits to clean up their own land. Second, they should increase the tribal police force in order to capture the large number of tribals involved in the narcotics trade. Finally, the tribe and its journalist friends should stop the nonsense that every rock and scorpion on the reservation (and in Arizona) is "sacred"; the hokum only impresses the liberals and unwashed at the University of Arizona.

[FITZ]

you'd better not mess with The Other Harry

It kind of gets me when someone so far from the problem ---like Virginia can't recognize there can be a problem. Even in Mexico itself there are discussions on the problems caused by massive migrations of people ---they also have similar situations. I was watching a television show broadcast from Juarez where the panelists were discussing the overwhelming strains to their city and region caused by hundreds of thousands of new residents moving in who had no money, no education. They discussed their hospitals, their schools, they discussed the strains put on the "locals" and their own regional culture, they discussed their now overwhelming crime rate and how the south of their city looks like a refugee camp with people living in cardboard boxes, people who think they can live in cardboard boxes because they come from warm climates like Honduras and Chiapas but the northern desert gets very cold in the winter. Not one person accused anyone of being a bigot or a racist for raising any concerns about overwhelming migrations of people.

[dennisw]

I've been reading about the Tohono O'Odham for years on illegal immigration matters and never new they has a casino(s?). I thought they all had a hard scrabble existence in a dry land. That their people were divided by the Mexican border from their Tohono O'Odham (Pima) brothers in Mexico. Thus I was more sympathetic of them. 

Thanks a lot

[dennisw]

my self, I've been hit twice, which is why I now drive a 4WD suburban.

The heavy metal strategy

[junta]

Say what? Do you have any proof of what are talking about? For the record incarceration rates and welfare rates are much higher for Mexican immigrants than native born whites. As for paying taxes according to several studies they fall quite short in being a positive tax gain per taxes used. As for being natural Republicans if they were why isn't Mexico utopia already?

[autoresponder]

4 illegals at $12/hr

cost employers less than

2 legal workers at $12/hr

New England and NY/NJ/PA have millions of Mexicans, Chinese, Central Americans, Russians working off the books paying no fed or state income taxes, no SS, no FICA, no Medicare deductions.

Employers pay no state unemployment insurance, no premiums for workers compensation, no match deductions.

Illegal means illegal.

Period.

If they can steal free food stamps and welfare while working under the table why can't I do the Enviro-Nutzies a big favor and steal the illegal aliens SUVs and property?

He who defends admitting and employing illegal aliens we soon be on the "RED-LIST" and is subject to our newfound liberal "outing" and "sharing" policies.

Illegal is illegal.

The party is over.

We are coming after the corporations, employers, politicians, immigracion whores, attorneys, ACLU, rights groups, bureaucrats.

We are going after your wallets.

We are going after your exposure.

We are going after your income.

We are going after your property.

We are going after your freedom.

-

Employers of illegals are stealing from the American taxpayer funded economy.

Steal from us and you are fair game.

We are after scalps.

[autoresponder]

Update on prison populations:

You may be correct that 25% are illegal aliens from one particular country.

Federal prisons nationwide totals boast a full 54% illegal alien population!

Compare that per/100,000 to any American citizen minority group.

It occurs to me that legal honest American minority citizens are blamed for much of the high minority violent criminal and prison percentages.