Top Republicans Break With Bush on Iraq Strategy

The New York Times ^ | 08/16/2002 | TODD S. PURDUM and PATRICK E. TYLER

[Torie]

Actually India has a larger middle class than China. The past is not always a guide to the future. The only thing that bails out China to some degree is the discipline of its people and Confucian traditions that are more amenable to the entreprenurial ethos and climate vis a vis India. But in the information age, that will not be enough. A freeer society like India is going to gain on China rather rapidly now.

[Torie]

I am not a feminist. That is an empty perspective. It doesn't do anything for me. But I am for equality for all human being before the bar of an impartial judiciary and law that prescribes an equal protection of rights, including property rights, for all citizens, including both genders.

[AIG]

England's had a long history of "English common law" and other institutions which made its transition to democracy easier. China has no legal tradition, which is all the more reason why China can't become a mirror image of America or England anytime soon. The best chance is to allow capitalism to grow, which by its very nature requires rules and regulations and is the best "teacher" of rule of law ever invented. Look at Russia. Did merely imposing a nominal democratic political structure on it make its society and culture suddenly law-abiding?

China is merely trying to rise out of Third World living conditions, but some paranoid people think this amounts to "fascism." But since when did wanting to rise out of Third World living conditions become a crime in Americans' eyes?

[maui_hawaii]

"alienating allies" means in Kissinger talk, "pissing off China, where our corporations have invested billions, and import cheap stuff from, at huge mark ups..."

[AIG]

Better than being one of India's poor illiterates, which is about 50% of India's population, despite 50 years of democracy.

[Sir Charles]

A very revealing analysis. Thanks for posting it for all of us to ponder, and I hope that many or most will come to the same conclusion and for the same reasons.

[AIG]

China's already #1 in cell phones, refridgerators, light bulbs, air conditioners, elevators, and various other product categories, even ahead of the US, let alone India. China is already #2 in PC's behind the US.

[maui_hawaii]

Whats the difference than being one of China's 1.28 billion poor illiterates?

[blondee123]

I guess they want GW to sit back & ignore saddam, just like billyboy ignored bin laden!!

[Torie]

China's already #1 in cell phones

That one does surprise me, since it seems everybody in the US has one. Care to back it up? In any event, you are missing my points, almost all of them I think.

[AIG]

For India, it's hard to change a majority-poor population into a majority middle-class population overnight, especially when the average Indian presidency lasts just 18 months and there is chronic legislative gridlock. Economics use a $3,000-$4,000 per-capita GDP benchmark at the point at which a country's economy starts to get the appearance of a more advanced world economy, and India is still far from that.

[AIG]

China's literacy rate is over 90%

[maui_hawaii]

China convienently excludes the peasants when they do their economic measurements, and hence the economic 'boom' is only a measurement of the cream of the crop, in certain places, and even then, its inflated. China's boom came because the US was hunting for cheap labor combined with a President who wanted to save the Communist Party from people still pissed off about 6-4.

[Rightwing Conspiratr1]

Kissinger is right Saudi Arabia and Iran are the main enemy not secular Iraq.

Nope he's wrong. Iraq is the pivot point. Iran is the only Islamic state in the region that is moving towards democracy and the government of Iran is struggling to hold onto power. We will have to deal with the strong possibility of a desperate Iranian government attempting to aid the neighboring Iraq. If we install a democratic regime in Iraq, Iran will topple like a house of cards. Saudi Arabia on the other hand is ruled by a monarch who has for years walked a line between friendly realtions with the US and placating a populace that is increasingly extreme Fundamentalist and hates the west. Civil war in Saudi Arabian is also very possible.

[blondee123]

It may be time to up Scrowcroft's meds

ROFLMBO!

[AIG]

"China's mobile phone market, the world's biggest with more than 176 million cellular users." -- Latecomer Sony Ericsson Dives Into China

[maui_hawaii]

Ok then, they are dirt poor, but know how to read.

[Torie]

This is from the Cia factbook:

India: GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $2,200 (2000 est.)

China: GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $3,600 (2000 est.)

I suspect the margin will erode, and that it is already in the process of doing so.

[AIG]

How did China's "cream of the crop" come into existence in the first place? Was it because China's economy has grown so fast in the past 20 years? By the same token, China's middle-class will add another 100-200 mil. into its ranks in the next 20 years. Remember, economics is a process.