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Singer's remark riles Hispanics -- Greeley debates 'English' comment
Denver Post ^ | July 9, 2002 | Michael Riley

Posted on 07/09/2002 10:43:24 AM PDT by Tancredo Fan

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To: Luis Gonzalez
Trust me when I tell you that it is inevitable.

Trust me when I tell you it's inevitable illegals are going to be deported. Congress is only delaying the inevitable, but it's going to happen. Sooner rather than later if we have another 9/11 debacle.

BTW, glad your kids all speak English, I have no problems with legal immigrants, only the illegals.

181 posted on 07/09/2002 5:31:50 PM PDT by Reaganwuzthebest
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To: Luis Gonzalez
Luis, we cross swords again, my FRiend.

You said, in part, " . . . And no one else has a right to place the ability (or the willingness) to speak English, or any other language for that matter, as a condition of citizenship, . . . ."

That is where you are wrong. This is America. We speak English. It is the common language that binds us together as Americans.

And, just as France, Germany, Italy, Spain, Mexico and every other country has the right to (and does) establish an "Official Language," so does the United States.

I enthusiastically support English as the only official language of America, and will resist with every fiber of my being any and every misguided attempt to force America into a "multi-language" country, officially.

If you want to speak Spanish, or Creole, or Bulgarian at home, that is just fine. But the languge of America is English.

IMHO, until a person can speak, read and write the English language, that person ought not to be able to enjoy the privilege of U.S. Citizenship. Used to be an absolute requirement, and I'll tell you what: It ought to be an absolute requirement today!

This business of trying to accomodate all the world's languages in our schools and government has certainly played a significant role in the Balkanization of America, and I, for one, am damn sick and tired of it!

Bi-lingual and multi-lingual programs should be abolished immediately! English, and only English, should be the language of the schools and the government, by law.

The sooner we Americans eliminate the Liberal/Socialist/Marxist Bastard's "Kiss the ass of every minority in the world when they move here" mentality, the sooner we can get on about the business of America!

I will readily agree that the immigrant population in America has added to the "mosaic" in a positive way. But I will argue that those immigrants who have accomodated to this culture by learning English have added even more.

No long term benefits will accrue to any person or to the country if, somehow, those who would destroy what and who we are as a people succeed in forcing America to become a multi-language Tower of Babel!

182 posted on 07/09/2002 5:32:25 PM PDT by Taxman
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To: Reaganwuzthebest
When MacAuliffe, clumsy , transparent idiot that he is, wants to make sure his party can continue to employ massive vote fraud, he feigns outrage over suggestions that a photo ID be required in order to certify the voter is registered.

The same clumsy tactic is used by activists who want illegals to be allowed to come and go as they please by feigning outrage over an insistence that immigrants learn english. It's so much easier to just take their insults and accusations of racism than it is to stand by and see our country destroyed by vote fraud and inundated by invaders.

I wish we could get some conservatives in office who didn't care about insults or insinuations. Some people who gave a tinplated $#!+ about this country would be nice to have in office I think.
183 posted on 07/09/2002 5:40:54 PM PDT by Twodees
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To: rmlew
It seems that you have no idea of what the Constitution actually is. It isn't a documented detail of our rights, but rather protects them from being violated by setting limits on the powers of a centralized government.

And no, Congress has no more of a "right" to set a national language, than it does to set a national religion. Look it up, it's under the header "First Amendment".

That little bit that you posted clearly states that government is limited to setting rules for Government, they do not have a right to set a language rule for me as I am not a part of "government".

BTW, save yourself the revisionist History. While "The United States of America" was founded mostly by British subjects and/or their progeny, the original 13 colonies had a vast population of non-British inhabitants, and the rest of America was colonized by various European nations.

184 posted on 07/09/2002 5:46:24 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez
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To: All
I live in Florida.I have many friends, born in the USA, who are proud of Cuban ancestry. All but the elders speak fluent English.On some occasions,they will speak Spanish amongst themselves.Out of POLITENESS, they will explain briefly to me in English, the basic gist of the conversation when they know I dont speak Spanish and they are conversing with someone who speaks English as a second language.

Manners! Imagine that!

When I lived in Germany for a while, courtesy of Uncle Sam, I learned a little Deutche.Enough so I would not unintentionally offend the civilians I came in contact with.It was their country, after all.

This country is mine.The language is English.A visitor/tourist is not expected to be fluent in English.It is only polite of them to learn a few phrases, please, thank you, excuse me etc.But in reality, most foreign tourists speak fairly good English.

An actual immigrant is being intentionally offensive in not learning English.I celebrate naive attempts by rude, offensive people to title me "racist". As a native born citizen of the USA,(native as in born here,and part American Indian) it is actually becoming a compliment and a badge of honor!

185 posted on 07/09/2002 5:46:57 PM PDT by sarasmom
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To: Luis Gonzalez
"...the illegals have no interest in learning the language..."

Now, stop and think for a second, that doesn't even make any sense.

Yes it does, I have worked with Mexican immigrants, some illegal (in Arizona) who had been in the country for several years and still spoke little or no English. What do illegals have to be afraid of, the INS isn't coming after them.

The FIRST thing anyone who moves to another country would want to do is learn the language.

186 posted on 07/09/2002 5:49:32 PM PDT by Reaganwuzthebest
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To: Luis Gonzalez
Do you favor the Balkanization of America Luis?

A common language with many cultures is what prevents such things from happening. You should give that some thought.

187 posted on 07/09/2002 5:50:21 PM PDT by jwalsh07
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To: Twodees
As usual, you have absolutely no substance, and it shows as in typical Liberal fashion, and lacking the ability to debate the issues, you resort to name-calling.

I am reading about your kind in Ann Coulter's new book "Slander", she's got your type pegged.
188 posted on 07/09/2002 5:53:25 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Tancredo Fan
Well damn, I think it's bigoted, racist, and hateful for "newcomers" to condemn proud Americans. In my view, the flag waving of an American citizen takes precedence over the flag hating of non American citizens.
189 posted on 07/09/2002 5:56:27 PM PDT by glory
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To: Twodees
I wish we could get some conservatives in office who didn't care about insults or insinuations. Some people who gave a tinplated $#!+ about this country would be nice to have in office I think.

Pat Buchanan would have been a good choice then, he doesn't seem to care what people say about him. But any politician who's willing to take on this immigration mess is going need the strongest of intestinal fortitude. Probably for lack of that is why nothing is being done about it.

190 posted on 07/09/2002 6:08:13 PM PDT by Reaganwuzthebest
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To: Reaganwuzthebest
I understand. I'm just getting fed up with the overall generalization people have of the INS. The top 10% are killing the rest of us. I've been working my butt off, 50 hours a week, and when I read something that says the INS is not doing anything, I get kind of ticked off.
191 posted on 07/09/2002 6:21:45 PM PDT by Marine Inspector
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To: FreedomFriend
Happening in Phoenix too. We moved to a nice area with new homes, I'd say firmly middle class neighborhood. Lived there for 6 years and not long before we moved out there were at least 4 or 5 houses that were "multi family" and one just a few doors down that put a door on the 2 car garage and had about 6 or 7 Mexican men living in there. Soon after we started finding beer cans along the side of our yard(we were on a corner lot) and all kinds of other trash--seems to be where these men would wait for thier ride to work. ALL of the original owners in this development were disappointed by what was going on including American citizens of Mexican origen who lived there. I know, we had a number of discussions on this. We finally decided it was time to get out, even if we stayed in Arizona. Fortunately an oppurtunity presented itself to put us closer to family in the midwest and we took it. I'm so thankful we sold our home in an unheard of 7 days for that area for only hundreds shy of our listing price. Because of the downturn it could take up to 6 mos to sell adding to that the credit problems of most who looked in that neighborhood oftentimes you had to lower your price to accomadate this or the sale would fall through just days before closing.
192 posted on 07/09/2002 6:28:52 PM PDT by glory
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To: Taxman
Read what I wrote very carefully, I never suggested that the language of America should be anything other than English. What I am saying is that you cannot impose a language as a condition of citizenship on citizens. What if a group of natural-born American citizens decide tomorrow that henceforth they will speak only Nepalese and live in the woods by themselves, away from the mainstream of society? What penalty will you impose on them?

Remember, impose an English only rule, and it stands for all, not just immigrants.

As long as I am able to function in our society, what language I speak is not the government's business, and the fact that you may not understand me while conducting a conversation with others, be it conducting business transactions, enjoying music, or simply conversing, is no excuse to set about the task of invalidating the First Amendment.

Please note that while the Founders were obviously Christians, there is no argument of imposing a "unifying" religion on American citizens.

Why question one part of the First Amendment, and not the rest of it?

As conservatives, it would seem to me that we would have a natural aversion to the government finding "solutions" such as this. After all, I thought that the idea was less government intrusion, not more.

More government is never the solution. If you don't believe me, watch what happens to the stock market if and when the government decides to involve itself in policing it, in the wake of the last few corporate scandals.

193 posted on 07/09/2002 6:38:36 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Luis Gonzalez
Trust me when I tell you that it is inevitable.

I wish it were true Luis. That may be what's happening in Florida with the Cubans, but in the Southwest with the Mexicans, it is not inevitable.

Daily, I see immigrants from Mexico, young and old, and their US born children, that have been here for 10 or more years, and still can not speak English. The sad part is, when I ask them why they have not learned to speak English, the answer is always the same. I don't have to.

We have accommodated the Mexican immigrant so much in the southwest, that they no longer have to learn the language.

The European immigrants that come, learn the language just like you said. With in three generations, they don't speak their native tongue.

194 posted on 07/09/2002 6:43:29 PM PDT by Marine Inspector
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To: jwalsh07
America HAS a common language...it's English, and nothing has ever changed that.

Here's my question. How do do you enforce a common language? Are you willing to monitor people to assure ourselves that they are speaking the Federally mandated language?

The children of immigrants will strive to speak English because they do not wish to remain outsiders, and the American culture is too strong to be denied.

This is a subject that I happen to be an expert in.

I lived it.
195 posted on 07/09/2002 6:46:39 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Luis Gonzalez
A) Immigrants should be proficient enough to read and comprehend. It should be mandated.

B) Traffic signs, Government related documents and the like remain in english. We simply can't translate everything for everyone. If they want to immigrate then they can learn enough to get by without getting run over by a bus because they can't read "STOP" at least.

Who cares what they speak at home.

196 posted on 07/09/2002 6:50:55 PM PDT by Jhoffa_
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To: Taxman
"IMHO, until a person can speak, read and write the English language, that person ought not to be able to enjoy the privilege of U.S. Citizenship."

So then, a new-born baby with any luck will be able to consider themselves a citizen upon graduation from High School?

Where exactly would you deport illiterate native-born Americans to?

Is Ebonics not acceptable?

197 posted on 07/09/2002 6:52:47 PM PDT by Luis Gonzalez
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To: Luis Gonzalez
It seems that you have no idea of what the Constitution actually is. It isn't a documented detail of our rights, but rather protects them from being violated by setting limits on the powers of a centralized government.
I gave the provision under which the government had the right to define a national language for official purposes.

And no, Congress has no more of a "right" to set a national language, than it does to set a national religion. Look it up, it's under the header "First Amendment".

We are haviong an apples and oranges situation. I'm talking about official language: aka one for official purposes. I am not talking about a law that would ban unoficial usage of other languages.

That little bit that you posted clearly states that government is limited to setting rules for Government, they do not have a right to set a language rule for me as I am not a part of "government".

When you contact the government, vote, engage in a judicial activity, or use government services, you can be required to use english.

BTW, save yourself the revisionist History. While "The United States of America" was founded mostly by British subjects and/or their progeny, the original 13 colonies had a vast population of non-British inhabitants, and the rest of America was colonized by various European nations.

Who created our polity and traditions?
Our culture and political traditions are based on Enlgish Whig culture of the 18th century.
I am a son of Immigrants from Poland and Sweden. As an American, I accept the Pilgrims and Chesapeake settlers as my cultural ancestors.
I cannot expect to be an American and reject our history, traditions, and political culture.

198 posted on 07/09/2002 6:53:22 PM PDT by rmlew
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To: Luis Gonzalez
PS: Please note.. This issue will only affect the first generation of immigrants.

Those who follow will (most likely) be educated in our language..

199 posted on 07/09/2002 6:55:44 PM PDT by Jhoffa_
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To: varon
"Many of them think they're cats and can do as they damn well please "

Consider that line stolen. whooooha!

200 posted on 07/09/2002 6:56:02 PM PDT by doglot
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