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Arafat Races...[Against] Bush
Debka ^ | 3/5/02 | Debka

Posted on 03/08/2002 5:53:58 PM PST by monkeyshine

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To: monkeyshine
Time will tell. I doubt it though. I suspect it will strengthen the will to fight. The key is to knock out capacity, and that is difficult unless Israel can control what goes into the West Bank. And that takes a lot of manpower, and will keep the Israeli body count up. But I could be wrong, and certainly hope I am, provided I am proved rather quickly wrong.
21 posted on 03/08/2002 7:21:56 PM PST by Torie
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To: Torie
Well I think you are wrong and will be wrong, for what it's worth :-).

Honestly, if 600 fighters surrendered today, along with ~60 killed, that means the will to fight is vanishing. These guys aren't Al-Queda. They have'nt travelled 1000's of miles all sworn to the death for this fight -- they are in a sense victims of their circumstances and geography, and it's easy for them to join in the fight when it doesn't mean anything, when peer pressure is there, but when you are staring at your dead buddy, and bullets are flying over your head, you might be more inclined to try to negotiate a peace for the sake of your mother and children.

22 posted on 03/08/2002 7:29:56 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: monkeyshine
Do you have a reference to the article which describes this massive roundup, and just who they were? I must admit that I missed it. If it was just a roundup of the usual suspects, or just a roundup of random bodies, I assume most will soon be released. They will have to be. But as I say, I don't know a thing about it.
23 posted on 03/08/2002 7:32:19 PM PST by Torie
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To: Torie
Admittedly, it's Debka reporting the 600 fighters surrendering. That's why I keep prefacing it with "if it's true".

But just read the sidebar for the news. Arafat called Powell today and begged him to get Sharon to call off the incursions (in his own words, of course). That means it's having an effect. And strangely, no Arabs leaders have issued any condemnations and the UN is also very quiet. I think the message to Arafat is "you are getting what you deserve. You asked for it, now you got it".

24 posted on 03/08/2002 7:39:02 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: Torie
"More Than 600 Palestinian Men Surrender to Israeli Forces in West Bank Tulkarm Camp – Most Armed Gunmen of Arafat’s Fatah Tanzim and Force-17 They Lay Down Arms After 24 Hours of House-to-House Combat with Israeli Infantrymen Small Pockets of Resistance Remain"

http://www.debka.com

25 posted on 03/08/2002 7:40:31 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: monkeyshine
Get back to be when you find an un Debka source. That source is about as reliable to me as Kudzu Flat or Sandnes.
26 posted on 03/08/2002 7:41:19 PM PST by Torie
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To: Torie
IDF Raids Continue; 300 Terrorists Surrounded

The IDF responded aggressively by attacking Palestinian targets throughout Gaza, Judea, and Samaria. Armored forces, covered by combat helicopters, entered the outskirts of Bethlehem from several directions and took over the neighborhoods originally founded for refugees that have since become terrorist strongholds. IDF troops entered Beit Jala, from where fire is often directed at homes in Jerusalem's Gilo neighborhood, and tanks approached the town as well. Among the some two-dozen Arabs reported killed in the various offensives was one terrorist eliminated in a helicopter-missile strike.

In Khan Yunis, Gaza, IDF forces killed about ten of Muhammad Dahlan's forces, including Gen. Ahmed Mafrej, commander of the central Gaza district and the most senior Palestinian killed since the Oslo War began. The IDF said his death was unintentional; he was not actively engaged in the fighting at the time. Arab sources said that Israeli naval ships launched several rockets at Gaza.

In Tul Karem in western Shomron, IDF forces continue to surround some 300 armed terrorists of Tanzim, Force 17, Hamas, and Islamic Jihad. Fire was exchanged there during the night; a Border Guard policeman and a soldier were each lightly wounded. Nine Arabs were killed there yesterday, and dozens were wounded. IDF sources said the army would not leave the area until all the terrorists were arrested. PLO sources said that the terrorists had planted mines in the camp, and that men wearing explosives packs were awaiting the IDF soldiers. PA diplomatic sources have begun an international campaign to pressure Israel not to enter the camp.

www.israelnationalnews.com

27 posted on 03/08/2002 7:44:00 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: Torie
Arutz7 (Israelnationalnews) also report 400 surrounded on another article. So if these 300-400-600 were surrounded, they either died or surrendered, no?
28 posted on 03/08/2002 7:49:14 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: monkeyshine
IDF forces continue to surround some 300 armed terrorists of Tanzim, Force 17, Hamas, and Islamic Jihad.

Let us both hope that is true, rather than hype. It sounds a bit too good to be true.

29 posted on 03/08/2002 7:50:42 PM PST by Torie
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To: monkeyshine
Terror Watch - 35 Persons Murdered in Attacks (IsraelNationalNews.com) Thirty-five innocent persons were killed in terrorist attacks throughout Israel this week between Friday, 1 March and Thursday night, 7 March 2002.
30 posted on 03/08/2002 7:51:29 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: Torie
Honestly, I don't think so. You gotta admit the IDF hasn't acted anywhere near capacity yet. This is a good way to utilize a little more smarts along with the firepower-- find the pockets, encircle them, and force them to surrender or die.

Apparantly the PA forces don't have the ability to outflank the IDF and launch a rear guard action against these surrounding forces.

31 posted on 03/08/2002 7:53:39 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: Torie
Gunmen surrender in Tul Karm; 42 Palestinians, 1 soldier killed

Saturday, March 09, 2002 Adar 25, 5762 Israel Time: 09:53 (GMT+2) Last update - 08:42 09/03/2002

By Jalal Bana, Amos Harel and Amira Hass, Ha'aretz Correspondents, and agencies

Two hundred armed Palestinians in the Tul Karm refugee camp, on the outskirts of the West Bank city, laid down their weapons Friday afternoon and gave themselves up to IDF troops in the camp on a day in which 44 Palestinians were killed during IDF operations in the territories. The Palestinians were among those surrounded by IDF troops in a central area of the camp who had engaged in fierce gunbattles with the soldiers since the troops entered the camp two days earlier.

According to an agreement reached between the Palestinian Authority and the army, the gunmen in the refugee camp were allowed to put down their weapons and surrender to IDF troops without fear of injury. Some 600 men, out of which 200 were armed, followed instructions announced on loudspeakers for every male between the ages of 15 and 50 to leave the camp unarmed.

All of the men who left the camp underwent a security check carried out by Shin Bet, in order to verify that they were not on a list of suspects wanted by Israel.

Judging by the small number of men who were involved in the fighting who gave themselves up, it is unclear how many of the armed men in the camp actually agreed to surrender.

32 posted on 03/08/2002 10:57:30 PM PST by monkeyshine
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To: monkeyshine
sounds like 600 surrendered. 200 were armed, with automatic rifles. 10 or so had warrants of arrest executed on them.

If true, not a bad day at all. No wonder Arfy is crying wolf.

33 posted on 03/08/2002 10:59:48 PM PST by recalcitrant
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