Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

BATF: Coerced Consent in Pinedale, Wyoming (Direct Link to Article)
Pinedale Roundup; Pinedale, Wyoming ^ | January 10, 2002 | Jason Mundy & Rob Shaul,editor

Posted on 01/13/2002 8:58:10 AM PST by Old Badger

click here to read article


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-99 next last
To: Travis McGee
They just might find that on their next visit.
"See? We were right all along!"
41 posted on 01/14/2002 8:47:31 AM PST by exodus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 40 | View Replies]

To: exodus
They'll find some "dope" too. Remember the wisecrack about "doper friends" in the article? A sure-fire way to get a lot of conservatives to say, "Well, then it's justified."
42 posted on 01/14/2002 8:51:32 AM PST by alpowolf
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: mpoulin
"...His cellmate, who DID sign a confession
(after seeing his granddaugter being tortured)
was never released.

Zoltan's advice to his students was very simple:
Never sign anything.
# 39 by mpoulin

************************

That would be hard to do under those circumstances,
but I bet signing didn't help that poor gentleman's granddaughter.

43 posted on 01/14/2002 8:52:32 AM PST by exodus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: alpowolf
Thank God he didn't have a copy of the Constitution in the house.
44 posted on 01/14/2002 8:55:23 AM PST by exodus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: exodus
It's a well established BATF playbook. These folks will be demoted for not following SOPs.
45 posted on 01/14/2002 8:58:33 AM PST by Travis McGee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee; harpseal
Just so you guys know, I'm gonna try real hard to stay on top of this one. Something about it has just really struck a nerve with me. This can't be allowed to "just go away".

And I, too, was very surprised that he wasn't "shot while resisting". Seems like an oversight, based on the BATF's past activities. I'm sure some of their superiors are up in arms right now; about them letting him live, not the way the raid was conducted.

46 posted on 01/14/2002 9:01:18 AM PST by John R. (Bob) Locke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 36 | View Replies]

To: John R. (Bob) Locke
Someone must have forgot to bring the pyrotechnics, or the ready drop bag of inert grenades and bomb making literature.
47 posted on 01/14/2002 9:05:54 AM PST by Travis McGee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee
I wonder where the "the rank and file police are on our side" crew is? In spite of overwhelming evidence to the contrary, some freepers insist that the JBTs are here to protect us.
48 posted on 01/14/2002 9:08:51 AM PST by from occupied ga
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 45 | View Replies]

To: from occupied ga
Of course they are here to protect us, but of course the best protection of all comes in a police state.
49 posted on 01/14/2002 9:12:48 AM PST by Travis McGee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee
The really sad part about this topic is the small number of people who have posted their outrage here on this thread. If this doesn't seriously offend the sensibilities of a large number of FR posters, then we're in bigger trouble than I thought.
50 posted on 01/14/2002 9:13:58 AM PST by John R. (Bob) Locke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 47 | View Replies]

To: mpoulin
"Never sign anything."

I don't know what I'd do if my granddaughter was being tortured, but in the case described here, I would have signed the form, with 2 slight modifications to my signature:

Let them try to bring THAT to court to prove I consented. :D
51 posted on 01/14/2002 9:16:58 AM PST by Joe Slobonavich
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 39 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee
Of course they are here to protect us, but of course the best protection of all comes in a police state.

And the easiest people to protect are six feet under...

52 posted on 01/14/2002 9:23:54 AM PST by John R. (Bob) Locke
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: John R. (Bob) Locke
Well in fairness this article was posted twice before this weekend with defective links to the story which kept dropping. (Old Badger's got it right this time!) That sort of spread out the thread.

********************************************************************

For any new freepers who don't know, I am writing a novel about the federal government's assault on the 2nd amendment which follows a scenario which could be put into action at almost any time in this era of the "Patriot Act". I think my novel will be more accessible than John Ross' fine novel "Unintended Consequences", (certainly it will be shorter, at under 400 pages, and it will not be gratuitously, needlessly sexual).

The novel starts in an NFL stadium high in a light tower when a groggy unemployed much VA-hospitalized "Gulf War Syndrome" vet awakens. He is dressed in desert cammies and has an AK-47 tied to him with a lanyard, has a terrible headache and a dry mouth and no clue what he is doing there. Just as he begins to sit up on the ledge, a helicopter comes into his view from the sun and he is shot by a local SWAT sniper. That is how the novel opens.

Naturally, when the local police go to this broke semi-retard loser's trailer in Virginia, they find it loaded with "assault rifles", "hate literature" and "bomb making materials". As you would expect. And quite convincing, to the sheeple watching on ABCNNBCBS. He did it, case closed.

Of course, 100s are dead by "his" bullets and many hundreds more are dead and injured in the panic and stampede. On Monday both houses of congress pass an emergency bill in record time outlawing the private possession of all centerfire semi-auto rifles, with a one-week turn in period and no buy-back. The few pro 2nd Amendment congressmen willing to speak are shouted into silence, the bill is passed and signed by the president, public opinion polls show overwhelming support for it.

The next Friday night there is a "gun store kristallnacht" in SE Virginia as "mobs of outraged citizens" in the dead patsy's home town torch them with gasoline bombs. The mobs are actually gang bangers on parole recruited by the acutal organizers of the stadium massacre, who are two deranged and power mad BATF officials. They hope by creating a massacre blamed on easy access to high capacity "assault rifles" to become the leaders of a new anti gun federal law enforcement division with sweeping powers and unlimited funding.

A decorated Viet Nam green beret is killed with a bomb secretly placed in his car, then it is leaked to the media that he was on his way to blow up a federal building when "his bomb went off prematurely". Other "false flag" black operations of this sort lead to a public climate of fear and hysteria over "right wing militia terrorism". The aim of the plotters is to have the president authorize the creation of a special covert federal unit which will be permitted to act outside the constitution to pro-actively terminate "suspected terrorists" using Phoenix Program tactics on American soil during "the emergency".

That is just the beginning, but as you can imagine, the plot does not exactly go according to plan. A new division of the BATF is secretly named the "lead agency" in the repression of "gun nuts and militia fanatics", when actually it was a rogue BATF senior official who orchestrated the stadium massacre in order to increase his power and his budget in the predictable reaction to the "right wing militia massacre and bombings". In fact, this official had conveniently already written contingency plans for this type of new counter terrorism unit, and is (as he planned) named the first chief of the new covert "Special Projects Division".

Anyway, the situation evolves into a sub rosa "dirty war" of secret arrests, covert "interrogation centers", "disappearances", assasinations and counter assasinations, with the JBTs using the latest computer, GPS, wireless, and digital face imaging technology, and the other side using their "ten million scoped deer rifles" one shot at a time that I used to write about. Running throughout the book is the race to solve the mystery of the stadium shooter: was he truly, as reported, a deranged former Marine, or just a hapless patsy? Did he even fire a shot? If he is a patsy, who put him up there with the rifle?

Needless to say, ABCNNBCBS has one opinion (the anti gun govt. line) while the internet forums are a hotbed of opposing theories. A website called FreeAmerica.Com plays a major role in revealing the details of the plot, the truth and the outcome is left up in the air until the very end, as some of the targeted "right wing gun nuts" take the dirty war back to the "Special Projects Division", and the full truth about the stadium massacre and aftermath is readied for airing on one new major news network, while the S.P.D. races to stop the story from airing by all the means at its disposal.

Post 9-11 I lost a couple of months of writing time, wondering if my novel would have any more relevance or would even be sellable. Current events such as those mentioned in the article above convince me that my story is more relevant than ever. I have been redirecting some of the plot line slightly to take into account legitimate fears of arab muslim terrorism, which have had the side effect of prodding most Americans to accept ever greater restrictions on their civil liberties. And as we see, we have a federal law enforcement apparatus which seems ever more willing to adopt gestapo tactics in the name of combating terrorism, and would like nothing more than to find domestic "right wing militia terrorist groups" to turn their new powers against.

And if the JBTs cannot find actual "right wing militia terrorists", it may prove very tempting to some in the "anti terrorism industry" to create them.

53 posted on 01/14/2002 9:24:04 AM PST by Travis McGee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 50 | View Replies]

To: John R. (Bob) Locke; travis McGee
Any new articles should go to both the police issues bump list "donut watch" and the bang_list. I too want some follow up on this but I doubt that any agent will be disciplined let alone fired.

Stay well - Stay safe - Stay armed - Yorktown

54 posted on 01/14/2002 9:32:09 AM PST by harpseal
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 52 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee
Let me know when the book comes out.
Do you have any other books?
55 posted on 01/14/2002 9:35:14 AM PST by exodus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 53 | View Replies]

To: harpseal
The only discipline will be for forgetting the pyro and the drop bag of "hate and bomb making literature".
56 posted on 01/14/2002 9:37:53 AM PST by Travis McGee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 54 | View Replies]

To: NoCurrentFreeperByThatName
Land of the free, huh?
32 by NoCurrentFreeperByThatName

************************

Yep.
Land of the free-to-obey.

57 posted on 01/14/2002 9:38:18 AM PST by exodus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 32 | View Replies]

To: exodus
This will be my first full length novel, if I get it published! Later this year I hope.
58 posted on 01/14/2002 9:39:01 AM PST by Travis McGee
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 55 | View Replies]

To: Travis McGee
but of course the best protection of all comes in a police state

The question arises, the best protection for whom? Undoubtedly the best protection for the police is found in a police state. Everyone is aware of the usual hammer and sickle rhetoric every time a cop is killed (they become instant heroes of the rodina) about how they put their lives on the live every day blah blah blah... I remember doing a calculation the last time a Baltimore cop was killed and figuring out that an ordinary baltimore citizen was more likely to get murdered than was a cop, and baltimore isn't a complete police state yet. (Although with Glendenning as gov and Kennedy as his anointed replacement can this be far behind?)

59 posted on 01/14/2002 9:45:17 AM PST by from occupied ga
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 49 | View Replies]

To: exodus
"...Independence limited

freedom of choices made for you

my friend

freedom of speech is words

that they will bend

freedom, with THEIR exception.....

FREEDOM NO LONGER FREES YOU!"

Metallica, 1988, from ...And Justice For All

60 posted on 01/14/2002 9:47:13 AM PST by WALLACE212
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 57 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first previous 1-2021-4041-6061-8081-99 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson