Afghanistan Is Like Nothing You've Ever Seen, Soviet Vets Say

LA Times ^ | 19 Sep 2001 | MAURA REYNOLDS

[jwalsh07]

Sorry, I missed this the first time.

We were real good at carpet-bombing Vietnam

Really? How did we miss Hanoi for all those years if we were so good?

[takenoprisoner]

We were real good at carpet-bombing Vietnam.

So why didn't we bomb Hanoi unmercifully rather than dirt roads and immeasureable parcels of jungle? I'll tell you why, because we were not committed. We were not committed because we were not serving a just cause and we knew it. But this fight is a just cause and is undeniably not a time to be merciful.

[FReethesheeples]

A word to the wise...

[takenoprisoner]

That's ok, people like you who think you can bomb the stone age back to the stone age give me pause. I'm just thinking the better approach is more along the lines of what Bush said: a long, long process, with a lot of things going on that the public never hears about, both here and abroad. Turning factions against each other behind the scenes. If the public can stomach it. Want to nuke half the world? Hope our allies don't mind the fallout....

I never said nuke, you did. But now that you mention it, we have been "fighting" terrorism for decades. At what juncture do we say enough is enough? Was the WTC not enough for you? I guess it wasn't. What will it take? Your parents, your wife, or your children to die at their hands to move you?

Personally, I want them all dead before they have a chance to kill my parents, wife, and children. We already know who they are and what they want because they told us themselves.

[FlyVet]

Actually, we did bomb Hanoi unmercifully several times, Linebacker II the last time, if I remember correctly. That's why they went to the peace table. The problem is, Kabul is already in ruins, there's nothing left to bomb. And I doubt the Taliban cares who gets bombed there. They won't be there, and obviously don't care about their people. And as far as me having a "bad attitude" or being defeated already, no, I don't think so. I spent 20 years in the Air Force. And,if this thing gets big and ugly, I'll be recalled. So be it. But at this point, you won't get me to believe we're going to fry half the world and win this war.

[PLMerite]

You're right. This one needs to be fought like they USED to fight 'em: "This is what we want, give it to us or die. And don't even THINK about rearing up on your hind legs to us again."

I hate to sound animalistic, but 7000 dead brings out the beast in me.

Sometimes the beast is right.

[jwalsh07]

I don't care where you spent 20 years, it doesn't change the fact that you are vying for the Neville Chamberlain award. Would 60,000 dead change your mind, 600,000? When would you act?

I'm 50, Regular Army 3 years. If they want me, I go tomorrow. Which member of the United States Government has you concerned that we are going to war with "half the world". You must have quotes for this somewhere.

[takenoprisoner]

Actually, we did bomb Hanoi unmercifully several times, Linebacker II the last time, if I remember correctly. That's why they went to the peace table.

They went to the peace table and we bailed out. We left everything behind including many of our friends and mega tons of artillery and weapons. But we would not have left in such a flurry leaving all behind had we bombed Hanoi unmercifully.

Whatever Linebacker II was, it was not relentless nor unmerciful.

[FlyVet]

We haven't been fighting terrorism much at all, that's the problem. It needs to get real ugly behind the scenes to fight terrorism. CIA got de-fanged back in the 70's, and you already know about Clinton's treason. What will it take for me? If we go after them now, and they come back with anything like they did 9/11, all bets are off. At that point, things like Dresden and Tokyo and Hiroshima come to mind. Desperate times call for desperate measures. And don't worry, I'll probably be one of the ones over there dying.

[neutrino]

Well worth reading. Despite numerous other posters who seem to feel that our ground troops can step on the enemy easily, I must admit to concerns. We'll have as long a logistical tail as it's possible to have, and the MOST friendly part of it is likely to be through RUSSIA!

Yes, night and thermal imaging let us own the night - but how does one determine whether a couple broke down camels and a half dozen assorted dirt bags are muj. or otherwise?

I've said before, and will keep saying - we need to use weapons of mass destruction. What of the innocents, you say? Look at how young the palie stone throwers are. Recall that Iran cleared Iraqi minefields by marching their own children through them. The only innocents over there are going to be our own 18 year old sons...and daughters.

[takenoprisoner]

I'm 50, Regular Army 3 years. If they want me, I go tomorrow.

I too am 50, regular Marine 4 years. I go tomorrow if needed whether they want me or not.

[FlyVet]

Which member of the United States Government has you concerned that we are going to war with "half the world". You must have quotes for this somewhere.

I'd say all of Islam and China is half the world. Do you trust China? I doubt it. I see them being an arms supplier for the bad guys in this mess. And I see a lot of oil money getting laundered to buy arms for them. And, who said anything about fighting? I'm just saying, don't fight them on their terms.

[takenoprisoner]

The only innocents over there are going to be our own 18 year old sons...and daughters.

Not if I have any say about it. I'm ready willing and able at 50. This is war! I will defend my family til death.

[jwalsh07]

Your way is the wrong way. You are right about what happened when Hanoi met the B52 bombers but that didn't happen until 1972! We waited far too long to involve the commie aristocracy in the war. By then public opinion was shot. We waited too long to hit at the head of the enemy. This time we have leaders who understand that we can wait no longer.

We deal with them now on our timetable or we give them more time to develop ways to kill Americans. I have 5 grandkids and I want them protected now.

[takenoprisoner]

I'd say all of Islam and China is half the world. Do you trust China? I doubt it. I see them being an arms supplier for the bad guys in this mess. And I see a lot of oil money getting laundered to buy arms for them. And, who said anything about fighting? I'm just saying, don't fight them on their terms.

Your fears are unfounded....obviously rooted in the propaganda fashioned by the terrorists. Fear not...as truth and righteousness are on our side. We shall conquer them inspite of China and inspite of the oil money. We are the richest and most powerful nation on the face of the earth. Fear us!

[jwalsh07]

I'd say all of Islam and China is half the world.

Who said we are at war with Islam and China. This is simply hyperbole conjured up in your head.

Do you trust China?

LOL

I doubt it. I see them being an arms supplier for the bad guys in this mess. And I see a lot of oil money getting laundered to buy arms for them.

So what? If they are dead they can't killl us, if they are broke they can't by arms and if rich Saudis continue to support bin Laden, then they will disappear under the "harboring" clause of President Bush.

And, who said anything about fighting? I'm just saying, don't fight them on their terms.

This we agree on, the fight will be on our terms and in places of our choosing. We will be efficient and merciless with the killers and compassionate with the innocents.

[jwalsh07]

I go tomorrow if needed whether they want me or not.

LOL, I've heard this said before, we have Marines in the family too.

[FlyVet]

It'll be interesting to see how this plays out. If I'm wrong, I'm wrong, wouldn't be the first time. I think you'll see more scalpels than sledgehammers, at least at first.

[takenoprisoner]

LOL, I've heard this said before, we have Marines in the family too.

Then you know what I say is true. Semper Fi, we do or die. So we always do!

[jwalsh07]

OK pax, see you later.