Developers of doomed Fla. tower were once accused of paying off officials: report (Champlain Towers - Surfside)

nypost.com ^ | 06.27.2021 | Jorge Fitz-Gibbon

[lastchance]

First the “You must have bribed an official to get your way.” Is a rather common accusation in the construction jungle of South Florida.

Second If bribes did occur it was probably to get the permit issued more quickly But I am sure there will be a close examination of what plans were approved.

Third. I read some of the reports on why buildings failed during Hurricane Andrew. There were plenty of code violations that somehow were “missed” by inspectors. Did you know rebar can simply vanish? I didn’t till then.

[dfwgator]

If Andrew went just 20 miles north of where it did, a lot of those buildings in that area would not have survived.

[yldstrk]

I totally agree.

[yldstrk]

How pray tell? The thing fell like a planned demolition.

[Lurker]

“How pray tell?”

It’s happened before. If just one of the upper levels fall the weight will exceed the carrying capacity of the floor below it shearing the supports. A chain reaction ensues and the floors drop.

An explosion isn’t necessary, just poor engineering, substandard materials, careless installers, or a myriad of other factors.

L

[chuck allen]

“Gently, Willis and his family led the woman with them to the first floor. The garage was flooded. They lifted the woman over a wall that had collapsed near the pool, and over a stretch of broken tiles. “At the moment, [focusing on saving the woman] takes your mind off it,” Willis said. “There is something else going on. When they got to the bottom floor, they found it had sunk at least three-four feet. There were chunks of concrete. There was debris”..

[Lurker]

We will have to wait for the failure analysis. That will take months.

At this point anyone offering a hypothesis is engaging in pure speculation.

L

[zeestephen]

Re: "Your premise is faulty."

The only time I have seen concrete deck buildings pancake is when they get imploded.

You, apparently, have seen them pancake under different circumstances?

Please share that experience with the group.

Thanks in advance for new engineering insights.

[Lurker]

“You, apparently, have seen them pancake under different circumstances?”

I have. Any number of things can cause a collapse like this as I have stated elsewhere on this thread.

L

[Justa]

Concrete can’t cut steel!!

/s

[yukong]

Because of a horribly written article...I believe you mis-construed the issue.

The developers bribed city officials over sewer issues at the property, to get construction started. Those sewer issues stalled other developments.

The 15 million in repairs were in reference to what structural engineers determined were needed in 2018 to get the building back up to the 40 year code review. This has nothing to do with the developers bribing city official back in 1981.

The owners (condo owners board members) are the ones that drug their feet on doing the needed repairs identified in 2018. No one who owned a condo wanted to cough up the 100,000 to 300,000 needed from each condo owner to afford the repair costs.

[HamiltonJay]

I am not saying nothing fishy went on with this building, but this report is garbage..

The Developer attempted to bribe someone to get a permit so they could get a property (not this one) up to code.

That’s not an indication of anything other than how screwed up the government is.

There is no indication or even accusation that this bribe had anything to do with this building, or anything to do with getting away with shoddy workmanship...

The story is they bribed someone to get a PERMIT so they could do work to bring a project up to code.... How messed up is the world if you need to bribe someone just to get a permit to do the work you need to do to fix somehting?

Non story

[gr8eman]

Unfortunately this brings us back to OK City and the World Trade center. IMO you are correct! How can a building “pancake” unless the supports all crumble at the same time? What are the odds?

[rxsid]

"The condominium board of directors needs to answer for this one. Let’s see the most recent facilities audit."

Yup!

If you haven't already, have a look at a report from a PE in 2018.

 

 

""At the ground level of the complex, vehicles can drive in next to a pool deck where residents would lounge in the sun. Mr. Morabito in 2018 said that the waterproofing below the pool deck and entrance drive was failing, “causing major structural damage to the concrete structural slab below these areas.”

The report added that “failure to replace the waterproofing in the near future will cause the extent of the concrete deterioration to expand exponentially.”

The problem, he said, was that the waterproofing was laid on a concrete slab that was flat, not sloped in a way that would allow water to run off, an issue he called a “major error” in the original design. The replacement would be “extremely expensive,” he warned, and cause a major disturbance to residents."

And that area of the worst structural issues he found sure looks like it's right in the area where the building collapsed first. Near the pool area.

The most significant structural issues begin around page 7 of his 2018 report.

[rxsid]

Corrected link: 2018 report.

[mund1011]

We will have to wait for the failure analysis. That will take months.
++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Failure analysis, like TWA 800? I am more inclined to believe my eyes than what the experts tell me lately.
More buildings should be pancaking soon because the design of the buildings, the environment, the bureaucracy are not limited to one address in Miami.

[yldstrk]

Give me a fer instance of when it happened before.

[yldstrk]

That’s not enough to collapse a building.

[rxsid]

"abundant cracking and spalling of varying degrees was observed in the concrete columns, beams, and walls. Several sizeable spalls were noted in both the topside of the entrance drive ramp and underside of the pool/entrance drive/planter slabs, which included instances with exposed, deteriorating rebar.

[rxsid]

"That’s not enough to collapse a building."

Deteriorated rebar and concrete columns/pads in 2018 that were likely "exponentially" worse by now is not enough to cause a foundation failure?