Posted on 05/24/2020 5:41:01 PM PDT by napscoordinator
You would restore Second Amendment rights to violent felons ?
Some released after ‘repaying ‘ their ‘debt to society’ for murders, rapes ...
“If you can’t decide to vote for Biden, then you ain’t no true ex-con!”
FR: Never Accept the Premise of Your Opponent’s Argument
I didn’t see any references to constitutional clauses in the referenced article to fully justify what the judge decided. But here are clauses that seem to indicate constitutional problems with what the judge allegedly said.
Section 2 of the 14th Amendment (14A) respects the 10th Amendment power of each state to deny the right to vote simply for being a felon imo, regardless of delinquent legal fees.
”14th Amendment, Section 2. Representatives shall be apportioned among the several States according to their respective numbers, counting the whole number of persons in each State, excluding Indians not taxed. But when the right to vote at any election for the choice of electors for President and Vice President of the United States, Representatives in Congress, the Executive and Judicial officers of a State, or the members of the Legislature thereof, is denied to any of the male inhabitants of such State, being twenty-one years of age, and citizens of the United States, or in any way abridged, except for participation in rebellion, or other crime [emphases added], the basis of representation therein shall be reduced in the proportion which the number of such male citizens shall bear to the whole number of male citizens twenty-one years of age in such State."
Note that voting rights amendments ratified after 14A was ratified effectively changed the voting eligibility criteria of Section 2 imo.
Next, consider that the only constitutionally express voting protection regarding money owed to whomever is limited to poll taxes or other taxes.
"24th Amendment:Section 1 of 2 sections. The right of citizens of the United States to vote in any primary or other election for President or Vice President, for electors for President or Vice President, or for Senator or Representative in Congress, shall not be denied or abridged by the United States or any state by reason of failure to pay any poll tax or other tax."
Corrections, insights welcome.
Send "Orange Man Bad" federal and state government Democrats and RINOs home in November!
Supporting PDJT with new patriot federal and state government leaders that will promise to fully support his already excellent work for MAGA and stopping SARS-CoV-2 will effectively give fast-working Trump a "third term" in office imo.
Exclnt !
Have they done their punitive prison time? If so, is their debt to society not paid? If their debt to society is not paid, why are they out of prison?
If their debt to society IS paid, why are they not entitled to ALL rights of a free citizen?
Take your time.
“I swear the RNC is so passive that it’s almost like they are the Democrats.”
Is a Romney still in charge of anything at the RNC? I know that Ronda Romney has screwed up everything that liberal puke has ever been in charge of. She royalty screwed up the MI republican party. It’s but a shell of what it once was.
If their debt to society IS paid, why are they not entitled to ALL rights of a free citizen?
Take your time.
I only needed a half a second to correctly answer your question.
If their sentence is BOTH a prison sentence and a fine, serving the time only pays part of the debt.
In order to enjoy ALL of the rights, they must fulfill ALL of the sentence.
You have a point, in that I did not address the fine aspect. You are absolutely correct, but where are the legal fees in your discourse, as that is considered an equal consideration to a fine in the article.
Can’t pay the lawyer, not a citizen? Not that ditching your lawyer is EVER a good idea...
I agree with you.
Can’t pay the lawyer, not a citizen? Not that ditching your lawyer is EVER a good idea...
I think you might be misinterpreting the term "legal fees". These are not the cost of your attorney, they are what are frequently called "court costs".
If you have ever had a traffic ticket, the total fine is often broken down in sub-accounts, a fine, court costs and possibly an assessment or two. The total is frequently referred to as a "fine" even though it really has these separate sub components.
If a party is found not guilty he does not have to pay any of the court costs, if he is found guilty, paying them is part of the sentence.
I have been victimized by this type of thing. A criminal stole from me and his sentence included jail time plus restitution for the costs of the stolen items. He served the time, but I never saw a penny of the restitution. This is the rule rather than the exception.
As an older and wiser person, today I would be hounding the court and the sheriff to take him back into custody if he did not pay the restitution. It really is part of the sentence.
So this judge wants to make sure that incompetent and stupid criminals can vote.
If you watch jesse watters on the beach asking questions to beach go’ers, these idiots vote to
If they’re too dangerous to have their 2nd amendment rights restored, they’re too dangerous to elect the direction of the country. There’s a reason felonies stay on your permanent record.
You and the Democrats need to choose whether felons get all rights are restored when their sentence is complete or none. We don’t just cherry pick certain ones because of their political usefulness to the Democrats.
Yup. Absolutely. They should regain their rights if they completed their sentence.
Yes. If they are not fit to be citizens, they shouldn't be out of jail yet.
Naive
There is a reason Felons Vote overwhelmingly Democrat.
Outside of Watergate, when was the last time a Registered Republican committed a Burglary?
That was exact;y my point, and trying to make me a democrat because I point out hypocrisy is pretty lame.
If they have paid their penalty, ALL rights should be restored. ALL of them, not the ones the LEFT wants to pick and choose, or certain folks that claim to be on the right but want to limit the rights of others.
See, I don’t actually think they should get all their rights back. I was using the illustration to make the point about how crazy your position is.
Felons who’ve served their time and are released are a higher risk to society than the general pubic and why we’re selective about which rights they get back because we’re still taking a gamble on them.
The left doesn’t want to expand anyone’s second amendment rights, but packaging up their gun rights as the cost of admission to get all those Democrat voters back on the rolls is a price they’d pay if forced, but they don’t even have to make that decision now or ever. That’s because voting rights restoration has universal Democrat support plus libertarian chumps lining up behind a theoretical argument which will never come to pass because the gun rights restoration argument is similarly crazy and reckless but with near universal opposition.
Well, I suppose we will never agree on this particular point. I understand your reasoning, but still do not agree with your stance. If the person is still a threat, then why are they no longer incarcerated? If they are a FREE CITIZEN, why do they not have the rights of a FREE CITIZEN?
You used the “vote” as a reason for denying rights to released former felons. How about “If you don’t pay net taxes, no vote for you?” Why should someone with no skin in the game get to say how tax dollars are spent?
Same reasoning, is it not?
After re-reading this, I may have weakened my argument, but I still stand by it. ;-)
Leaving people in prison for life is expensive and overkill in many cases depending on the offense. However, unlike misdemeanors, felonies are major offenses and therefore stay on your record for life. You’re only a former felon if the conviction is reversed by a court order.
Democrats don’t care about any of that or keeping guns out of their hands or keeping any restraining orders in place. All they care is getting these people a ballot, and we shouldn’t help them in that endeavor. I don’t see the point in helping them lock us out of the electoral process on the hope that they’ll sacrifice some sacred cows in the name of fairness at some point in the future. They never will.
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