Bump.
Posted on 12/18/2018 8:18:56 AM PST by PeaRidge
That letter from John C. Calhoun could be written today.
Not any more.
What state bucks the Federal Government now? They are all supine.
Our Nation has lost that which made us unique. To it's detriment.
Not any more.
What state bucks the Federal Government now? They are all supine.
Our Nation has lost that which made us unique. To it's detriment.
Don’t alert the folks who think the North was justified for the civil war and that it was about slavery. I’ve always maintained it was about control.
The one thing Henry Clay regretted was playing dirty with election politics against Andrew Jackson because he lit a fire in Jackson that stayed lit and burned in Jackson until Jackson took his last breath. The Democrats against Trump would do well to revisit the history of Jackson and learn from him.
In the Southern States there are two entirely distinct and separate races, and one has been held in subjection to the other by peaceful inheritance from worthy and patriotic ancestors, and all who know the races, well know that it is the only form of government that can preserve both and administer the blessings of civilization with order and in harmony.
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In 1861, my great, great grandfather, his brother and his son met just about 8 miles from where I sit right now typing on this keyboard and rode off to the Civil War. 4 years later, only my grandfather returned.
And, if I had been around back then, most likely I would have rode off with them. Who knows?
But, I can safely say, that in 2018, 157 years later, I totally disagree with Calhoun, a great orator and master of “words”, that one race should “be held in subjection” to another race.
Whipping black people and hanging them in a tree without due process is not “peaceful” or “harmonious” to the person on the receiving end of the hangmans rope or whip. It’s always amazed me that 600,000 guys went out in the woods and fought to the death over slavery (please don’t tell me about states rights).
I see your point.
I suspect a lot of soldiers , north and south, fought because their local community leaders told them to, most people did not travel 100 miles from home in their lives. If you were told to sign up you did. To do otherwise is to be ostracized from the only home you know.
Dixie Ping
I think that line was quoting Pickens, not Calhoun. But your point stands ...
It was about control. The south,headed by the slavocracy, controlled the union - until they didn't. Then they freaked out and tried to upend our republic.
Really good points!
Ah ...we get to ‘refight’ the causes of the Civil War.
Here is a challenge for those defending the south....
Google to find the various Secession Resolutions that were passed by southern states when they decided to secede. Those resolutions are their ‘justification’ for leaving the union.
(Or - find the book “The President’s War; Six Presidents and the Civil War that Divided them”. In the appendices - you can find some of the secession resolutions.)
Those southern states typically spoke out STRONGLY on their belief that slavery was legal and should be maintained, and that the Union would take away their right to keep and control slaves. The southern states conveniently believed in ‘federalism’ when it was convenient...they wanted the federal government to support efforts to track down and return slaves from free states. Today - southern ‘sympathizers’ claim that they were against federalism...which they were - WHEN IT WAS CONVENIENT.
So - bottom line - initially - the northern states did NOT fight to ‘free the slaves’ (that came later) - but initially - it was to preserve the union. OTOH - the south definitely seceded and was willing to fight to PRESERVE slavery.
As to ‘justified’ ....play a mental game, if you will....and be honest. Assume you were a slave in the south in 1859. Would you be willing to continue suffering in slavery for another 10, 20, 30 or more years - hoping that eventually slavery would be ended...peacefully? How many years would you be wanting to see this evil institution continue, slaves suffering under the lash, slave families broken up at the whim of their ‘master’? If you would be willing to see a Civil War to ensure your freedom - sooner than later....then you should understand that the Civil War - as bad as it was - was less evil than the institution of slavery.
Have you really READ Lincoln’s 2nd Inaugural Address? If not - carefully read this passage - and see if it honestly addresses the issue:
LINCOLN: “One-eighth of the whole population were colored slaves, not distributed generally over the Union, but localized in the southern part of it. These slaves constituted a peculiar and powerful interest. All knew that this interest was somehow the cause of the war. To strengthen, perpetuate, and extend this interest was the object for which the insurgents would rend the Union even by war, while the Government claimed no right to do more than to restrict the territorial enlargement of it. Neither party expected for the war the magnitude or the duration which it has already attained. Neither anticipated that the cause of the conflict might cease with or even before the conflict itself should cease. Each looked for an easier triumph, and a result less fundamental and astounding. Both read the same Bible and pray to the same God, and each invokes His aid against the other. It may seem strange that any men should dare to ask a just God’s assistance in wringing their bread from the sweat of other men’s faces, but let us judge not, that we be not judged. The prayers of both could not be answered. That of neither has been answered fully. The Almighty has His own purposes. “Woe unto the world because of offenses; for it must needs be that offenses come, but woe to that man by whom the offense cometh.” If we shall suppose that American slavery is one of those offenses which, in the providence of God, must needs come, but which, having continued through His appointed time, He now wills to remove, and that He gives to both North and South this terrible war as the woe due to those by whom the offense came, shall we discern therein any departure from those divine attributes which the believers in a living God always ascribe to Him? Fondly do we hope, fervently do we pray, that this mighty scourge of war may speedily pass away.
[HERE IS THE IMPORTANT PART] Yet, if God wills that it continue until all the wealth piled by the bondsman’s two hundred and fifty years of unrequited toil shall be sunk, and until every drop of blood drawn with the lash shall be paid by another drawn with the sword, as was said three thousand years ago, so still it must be said “the judgments of the Lord are true and righteous altogether.”
Bump.
Why is living in ignorance so grand?
If the union was a slavocracy then it was codified in the US Constitution.
All evidence to the contrary notwithstanding.
I say again. Look around you.
Ah...someone steps up to defend slavery. Want to see it returned? Why not - if the Civil War was wrong to end it? Try to be logical and consistent.
Try to find/read the book: “Emancipating Slaves, Enslaving Free Men: A History of the American Civil War”. Good study of the evil institution and how it corrupted the souls of those in the south who embraced slavery. Sure- the North wasn’t perfect - it had its own problems...but nothing on the level as chattel slavery.
IIRC - it was about 400,000 Union troops died to preserve the Union and end slavery. They should be honored.
About 300,000 Southern troops died - fighting to preserve slavery. They don’t deserve the same measure of honor.
‘The Butcher’??? And what term would you use for the many many Southern masters who lashed their slaves...killing those whom they wished to kill, raping those women whom they wished to rape - and selling/sending family members away for the convenience (or profit) of the master...and ignore the humanity of the slave?
Your ‘early 1861 were suing for peace’ is not realistic. The firing on Ft. Sumter - April 12, 1861....was in ‘early 1861 and STARTED the Civil War.
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