Posted on 08/21/2018 3:01:15 AM PDT by Libloather
So you admit that having big money involved in the prison system is the source of corruption.
By having small individual contractors provide for a non-profit government entity you minimize the amount of money controlled by one hand. Their power and payoff from bribing a judge/DA is minimal. At worst, they may get fatter contracts and some prison officials get kickbacks.
By having large for-profit prison corporations with a direct financial incentive per inmate, you absolutely maximize the risk of false imprisonment. By concentrating the profit, a tiny piece is enough to easily buy judges for even greater direct profits. You have fewer people controlling more cash with less oversight.
Sorry, but I reject your “capitalism is bad” malarkey. You have given NO EVIDENCE of any sort or source to prove your prejudiced speculation. Come back when you have FACTS and not speculation.
I never said capitalism is bad. The bad thing is having a system where agents of the state have license to imprison people in a place where more profit is created for private individuals when imprisoning more people. Everything else on this planet can run as capitalism with a profit. Just not the business of holding people prisoner.
We already have had numerous incidents and it is clear that human nature in such a system leads to false imprisonment for profit.
The implication was (and is) quite plain.
"The bad thing is having a system where agents of the state have license to imprison people in a place where more profit is created for private individuals when imprisoning more people.
And yet, privately operated prisons have been part of the penal justice system forever. The 1980 date I picked was the point where the number began to increase more quickly, not when first established.
"Everything else on this planet can run as capitalism with a profit. Just not the business of holding people prisoner."
IOW, capitalism is evil.
"We already have had numerous incidents and it is clear that human nature in such a system leads to false imprisonment for profit.
How "numerous"? This is a nation of 300+ million people. I am sure that one can find "numerous" (i.e. >1 )for pretty much anything at all.
I repeat....you have no data to speak of. You have never done anything but wave your hands in the air when asked to produce proof. Come back when you actually have some validated data.
“IOW, capitalism is evil.”
No, punishment simply should not be connected to profit in a civilized society. It creates happiness for the profiteers when they hand down punishment to others. Profit should not be connected in any way to punishing or hurting others.
Eventually they seek more ways to expand and bring in more people to punish. Expansion through profit is the goal of capitalism and should not be applied to prisons.
Do you believe police should be private too and profit from making more arrests? That is no different from an arrest quota system that every civilized person should be 100% against. Even though very few cops are convicted, we all know such things create incentive to be corrupt and should not be allowed. This cop ruined countless innocent lives, threatened to out the entire NYPD quota culture and got a sweetheart deal with no jail. MASS corruption via creating incentive to punish.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2095772/Cowboy-cop-Jason-Arbeeny-planted-crack-couples-car-seat-escapes-jail.html
More money in fewer hands that profit from more prisoners = more corruption that leads to false imprisonment. Plain and obvious as day.
While many private enterprises did partner with prisons, the only large fully private prison in early History is San Quentin. I’m not talking about the tiny individual jails and ships that were private but had little power to corrupt. In SQ, leadership was very quickly taken by the government by force after mass corruption by a private owner driven by greed:
“Originally, the prison was contracted out to private individuals to run and maintain. James Estell, not seeing much profit in the venture, opted out, turning over his contract to John F. McCauley in 1857.
According to reports, McCauley ignored prison inspectors, used harsh methods of punishment and kept prisoners barefoot and half-clothed.
When word of the conditions reached the State Legislature, “they declared the lease (with McCauley) null and void and advised the state to take immediate charge.”
On May 1, 1858, Gov. John B. Weller took over the prison “by force,” according to reports.”
Enough already. You have nothing except a theory you happen to like and anecdotal stories that seem to offer support. This is my last word.....come back when you have VALIDATED DATA. I will not continue a discussion which consists only of you posting the same thing over and over using different words.
GOOD BYE!
You didn’t answer me what you think of private police.
There is no “big data” on such a thing because it is illegal and happens at such a high level. The number of prison corporations is very small and even cases in the single digits are significant. While the number of individual cases are small, each one affects MANY MANY people. We still do not know the extent of what happened.
Israel considered privatizing and their supreme court rejected private prisons. The judges cited no data and had no need for it. Understanding of human nature was enough to know what would happen behind closed doors once legalized. One job of lawmakers is to reject bad law before it gets implemented. Not “give it a chance” while waiting for data and damaged people to pop up.
Allowing unrestricted profit from punishment will lead to those profits creating pressures to increase how much punishment they can “sell”. The main goal of private corporations is ALWAYS to expand and increase profits. Society wants fewer law breakers and fewer prisons. The prison corporations want the exact opposite to maximize profits. Private prisons and private police are NOT compatible with the goals of a just society.
The cop I linked you in the article implicated a dozen cops and several superiors. Even after video evidence, none went to jail and there is zero data of the entire network of corruption.
This happens countless times all over and is covered up via “good ole boy” networks across the country. At higher levels like judges, etc it goes completely unnoticed.
P.S.- Canada performed a comparison of identical prisons. Public versus Private. Private prison run by an American corporation with long time experience.
It was found that the private prison performed worse in every single metric for the same tax dollars. They were cutting services with no benefit to anyone except their own pocket. Exactly what the Israeli Supreme Court and anyone else that understands humans predicted would happen after privatization
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