Posted on 04/22/2015 7:07:01 PM PDT by NetAddicted
Thanks — you are way off the Greek /Hebrew translation if you see tithing any where in the new testament. It is not there. “Moral”? How about actually being in the New Testament? Who made you the professor of” moral”. Stick to the actual Bible. The “corruption” that Jesus hated and physically attacked was the collection of money in the name of God in the Temple of God. If you really do a scholarly study — after the resurrection and as written in the Hebrew and Greek— There was no “Church” . You know that, don’t you? The word was “Ekklesia” meaning “the called out” ( i.e. believers ) The term “church” was injected in the KJV in 1611! It displaced insertion was a total corruption of the real “WORD”. Ekklesia!!
You don’t realize that Jesus died for our sins if and only if we accept Him as the Son of God. You want the legalism of the the old testament like the book of James wanted. If you think the Jews are still “the chosen people”, they have sure been poorly protected. He who has the Son of God has life. He who does not have the son of God does not have life. The Jews had every opportunity in a front row seat and rejected Jesus. No life.
“He who has the Son of God has life.”
Yep. Here’s a passage on who the “chosen ones” of this age are:
Gal 6:15 - For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision availeth any thing, nor uncircumcision, but a new creature.
Gal 6:16 - And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
New living translation:
Gal 6:16 -
May God’s peace and mercy be upon all who live by this principle; they are the new people of God.
This, in response to a post in which I unequivocally stated otherwise.
You're a liar and a bearer of false witness. and you're a waste of my time.
I think you might also be too imbecilic to understand the definition of replacement theology.
You might want to educate yourself.
“You don’t realize that Jesus died for our sins if and only if we accept Him as the Son of God.”
I don’t think anyone here disagrees.
“You want the legalism of the the old testament like the book of James wanted.”
The Book of James says no such thing, and no one wants legalism.
“If you think the Jews are still “the chosen people”, they have sure been poorly protected.”
They are the Chosen People. As often noted here, “chosen” does not mean “better.” It means “chosen.” Jews are in denial of Christ, yes. And, like the many times recorded from the wandering in the Sinai, to the destruction of Jerusalem and exile to Babylon, to the destruction of the Second Temple, they face consequences for their actions. But that does not un-choose them. To the contrary, despite continual, incomparable, persecution, they have remained as a People, in evidence of His promise to retain them and protect a “remnant.”
“He who has the Son of God has life. He who does not have the son of God does not have life. The Jews had every opportunity in a front row seat and rejected Jesus. No life.”
Sure. No one disputes this. Doesn’t make them no longer the Chosen People. God chose. Human action cannot undo His choice.
Upon reading all your posts, I think Stormfront is a better place for you than FreeRepublic. You are clearly an anti-Semitic idiot.
This one does have quite an interesting posting history.
He uses the New Testament to justify some of his views here, but on other threads he completely dismisses the NT as meaningless because it was written by individuals other than Jesus...!
Peters defense to the actual leadership that had Jesus crucified. Where is it written the gentile believers should gentilize the Jewish believers?
Reeks of a Democrat Underground poster who thinks he is posting like a caricature of a conservative.
I saw your post too late. I will ignore.
“Peters defense to the actual leadership that had Jesus crucified.”
Acts 4:10, All of Israel was being addressed:
“Then know this, you and all the people of Israel: It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed.”
“Where is it written the gentile believers should gentilize the Jewish believers?”
The way to Salvation for Jews and Gentiles is through Jesus Christ. Jesus Christ wants us all “Jews, Gentiles” to come together through him:
Gal 6:16 - And as many as walk according to this rule, peace be on them, and mercy, and upon the Israel of God.
New living translation:
Gal 6:16 -
May God’s peace and mercy be upon all who live by this principle; they are the new people of God.
The “Israel of God” are now those with Christ in them.
Caricature is the perfect word to describe this one.
Ah Acts 4:10 Peter does not say all Israel crucified the Christ only the man healed is healed by Christ whom the leadership crucified.
Where does a Jewish believer have to stop being Jewish to be saved?
Galatians is addressed to gentile believers. Gentiles don’t have to become Jews to be saved but by the same name Jewish believers are saved.
You’re not looking at the 3 verses collectively:
Acts 4:10-12:
“Then know this, you and all the people of Israel: It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed.
Jesus is the stone you builders rejected, which has become the cornerstone.
Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved.”
You’re argument is now with God and his written word.
The Jews rejected Christ and so salvation was extended, by grace, to the Gentiles, until the time of the Gentiles is complete. Then the Father and Christ will turn back to complete His work with the Jews. They will always be His people. He promised and He has yet to fulfill ALL His promises to them. I believe that will be done during the Millennium.
“Where does a Jewish believer have to stop being Jewish to be saved?
Galatians is addressed to gentile believers. Gentiles don’t have to become Jews to be saved but by the same name Jewish believers are saved.”
Acts 2:36-38
36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.
37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do?
38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
You are forgetting Peter is talking to the leadership so don’t take the text out of context and say it means something else. Peter does not accuse all Israel but testifies to all Israel in verse 10. Was all Israel there at the examination? No! So how can “whom ye crucified” apply to anyone not there?
Look at
Mathew 26:57And they that had laid hold on Jesus led him away to Caiaphas the high priest, where the scribes and the elders were assembled. 58 But Peter followed him afar off unto the high priest’s palace, and went in, and sat with the servants, to see the end.
Peter knows who crucified Jesus and so do the people who participated in having Christ crucified.
Acts4:6 And Annas the high priest, and Caiaphas, and John, and Alexander, and as many as were of the kindred of the high priest, were gathered together at Jerusalem. 7 And when they had set them in the midst, they asked, By what power, or by what name, have ye done this? 8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel, 9 If we this day be examined of the good deed done to the impotent man, by what means he is made whole;
Do Jewish believers have to stop being Jewish?
Anyone who has not sinned didn’t crucify Christ.
Does a Jewish believer have to stop being Jewish?
There’s a difference between corporate and personal.
Romans 11:
The remnant spoken of in the chapter is those who were believers in Christ.
Israel’s corporate status is that of being divorced, under chastisement, rejected by God.
“11 I say then, Have they stumbled that they should fall? God forbid: but rather through their fall salvation is come unto the Gentiles, for to provoke them to jealousy.”
We see in verse 11 “they should fall” means that they should continue in that state permanently, to which the answer is emphatically no. But it says they are in that fallen state, as it continues “through their fall”.
“12 Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?”
“The fall of them” - they are fallen.
“15 For if the casting away of them be the reconciling of the world, what shall the receiving of them be, but life from the dead?”
They are cast away. They must be in a state of being cast away in verse 15, else they could not in the same verse be received back in the future.
They are a branch “broken off”:
“17 And if some of the branches be broken off, and thou, being a wild olive tree, wert grafted in among them, and with them partakest of the root and fatness of the olive tree;”
Again:
“20 Well; because of unbelief they were broken off, and thou standest by faith. Be not highminded, but fear:”
Note that the roots of their problem were in unbelief.
That’s what is so often misunderstand, even though it permeates the entire Old Testament - being a Jew was always first and foremost about faith and belief. Non-Jews were converted to Judaism. Many of the ancient Israelites faced temporal judgements because of unbelief. There came to be this enormous emphasis on bloodlines, but if you study the entire Bible, you’ll find consistently that the definition of a child of God is always about faith and belief and not bloodlines. The Psalms are filled with this idea, which is why exclusive Psalmody is hated by so many Churches; getting rid of Psalm-singing is a great help to those who ant to introduce unscriptural teaching and substitute their own teaching in a Church, since the people singing the Psalms are weekly singing doctrinal truth, and it stands in contrast to false teaching in sermons.
God did not spare the natural branches:
“21 For if God spared not the natural branches, take heed lest he also spare not thee.”
They were cut off:
“22 Behold therefore the goodness and severity of God: on them which fell, severity; but toward thee, goodness, if thou continue in his goodness: otherwise thou also shalt be cut off.”
and Christians are warned to continue in his goodness or they will also be cut off.
Note carefully on the “grafting in” - it is only for those who believe:
“23 And they also, if they abide not still in unbelief, shall be grafted in: for God is able to graft them in again.”
The phrase “all Israel”:
“26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:”
refers to Israel as a corporate body, not to say that every single last Jewish individual will be saved, any more than every Gentile will be saved.
This verse is still true if we remember:
Romans 2
“28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither is that circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
29 But he is a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision is that of the heart, in the spirit, and not in the letter; whose praise is not of men, but of God.”
Yes, clearly all who are true believers in Christ will be saved.
What has happened in the last few decades is the political manuevering in the US amongst mostly Evangelical Churches, but other denominations undoubtedly as well, where the false eschatology which began in the 1800s has had the modern state of Israel slid into doctrine on eschatology, all the while the modern state of Israel has a very strong leftist/socialist bent and is even reportedly the “gay capital” of the east:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LGBT_rights_in_Israel
In fact, www.persecution.com, website of The Voice of the Martyrs, lists Israel as a hostile nation on its prayer map page (you have to click to see its current report):
http://www.persecution.com/public/prayermap.aspx?
I am always very interested to know what is going on behind the scenes with military and diplomatic alliances and actions where America is concerned nowadays, since I stopped assuming every American policy was acceptable to God by definition. So I seek a little truth, background, details, etc., on our government-defined “allies” as well as “enemies” - just what is going on an why, I wonder.
When someone tells me American policy is coming from the Bible - though I would love it if it were true - I tend to be a bit skeptical these days with all the wickedness in high places in the US. Since I’ve been actually studying the Bible these past few years, usually I find when they wave the Bible in front of my face and say they want to use it to justify a US government action, I usually find their theology to be flat-out wrong. And this is not surprising, IMHO, given that so many American leaders seem to have nothing but hatred of those who “CLING TO THEIR GUNS AND BIBLES”.
While we can be sure that Biblical prophesy will all come to pass, the human understanding of prophesy before and during its fulfillment has always been wanting, except, of course, for direct, personal revelation by God, which ended with the New Testament. The Word of God we have now is the Bible.
I hope and pray we can proceed, Lord willing, with seeking truth about this and all matters.
I prefer God’s way, not man’s way:
Matthew 6:10 “Thy kingdom come, Thy will be done in earth, as it is in heaven.”
Right. /Wink
“You are forgetting Peter is talking to the leadership so don’t take the text out of context and say it means something else.”
No he’s not. He was addressing all of Israel. Qouting: “and to all the people of Israel” Again, you’re rewriting scripture, therefore your argument is now with God.
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