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What We're Afraid to Say About Ebola
New York Times ^ | 9/11/2014 | MICHAEL T. OSTERHOLM

Posted on 09/11/2014 11:23:51 PM PDT by DouglasKC

click here to read article


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To: Black Agnes
GREat. Then you can tell me how many CDC personnel work for MSF in the isolation wards themselves treating ebola patients. And why MSF so obviously flouts the ‘mask, gown, and gloves’ only protocol in their isolation wards! And whether the CDC ‘fellows’ that supposedly care for ebola patients in the isolation wards adhere to MSF protocol or simply follow the ‘mask, gown and gloves’ one?

You clearly don't even bother to comprehend what I am writing.

There are no clear boundaries between MSF and the CDC. Therefore, it makes no sense to ask how many CDC vs. how many MSF personnel there are in the various quarentine and isolation wards.

Further, there are no 'MSF' protocols. There are no 'CDC' protocols, for that matter. There are universally-accepted safe practices that both organizations follow.

You seem to be very attached to remaining ignorant, even after I instruct. Ergo, I will move on. Have fun flipping out! :)

141 posted on 09/12/2014 10:23:21 AM PDT by Lazamataz (First we beat the Soviet Union. Then we became them.)
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To: Lazamataz

So the ‘theater’ of an infectious ebola ward full of symptomatic patients doing what symptomatic patients do with this disease is somehow different if it’s in the US vs. Africa?

Because ebola has a map and knows zipcodes?

Because symptomatic patients who puke, poop, faint, drool and otherwise expel ebola tainted fluids are somehow LESS dangerous and ONLY require ‘mask, gown and gloves’, but someone merely working with a vial of ebola in a lab somewhere is MUCH more at risk and justifies a BHL4 lab with a negative pressure suit.

Right?


142 posted on 09/12/2014 10:24:39 AM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: Black Agnes
So the ‘theater’ of an infectious ebola ward full of symptomatic patients doing what symptomatic patients do with this disease is somehow different if it’s in the US vs. Africa? Because ebola has a map and knows zipcodes?

Wow.

Just, wow.

I think the biggest disease potential on this thread is Diarrhea Mouth. LOL

I'm out.

143 posted on 09/12/2014 10:26:22 AM PDT by Lazamataz (First we beat the Soviet Union. Then we became them.)
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To: Lazamataz

I do absolutely comprehand what you’re writing.

That the MSF CDC ‘collaboration’ is so good that MSF has apparently given the CDC regulations the finger and gone above and beyond those in order to keep their own people safe.

I will ‘believe’ CDC protocols are sufficient when I see MSF people who work in the isolation wards doff the goggles, facemasks and a layer of protection.

Unless you want me to believe that MSF higherups somehow make money on all those extra layers of protection and are invested in companies that produce them?


144 posted on 09/12/2014 10:26:32 AM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: Lazamataz

If may be so bold to try to squeeze in one more silly message:
Is a hypochondriac more prone to Ebola?
I remember when AIDS first showed up and it was said to be a a disease of the Three H’s (homosexuals, heroin users and hemophiliacs). I often thought that should be Four H’s - to include hypochondriacs.


145 posted on 09/12/2014 10:27:32 AM PDT by HandyDandy (Started out with Burgundy but soon hit the harder stuff....)
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To: Lazamataz

You’re the very one that said the level of protection depended on the ‘theater’.

I asked how a ward of ebola patients here was different from a ward of ebola patients there.

Because for here the cdc is saying ‘mask, gown and gloves’ is sufficient.

And clearly, from the MSF protocols, those are insufficient there.

How are ebola patients here different from ebola patients there?


146 posted on 09/12/2014 10:28:05 AM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: BunnySlippers
I still do not think it can take hold here like it can in Africa.

I wouldn't count on that. I think that's just wishful thinking t this point.

Not only *can* it, but it will.

Cities will not be safe.

147 posted on 09/12/2014 10:31:40 AM PDT by metmom (...fixing our eyes on Jesus, the Author and Perfecter of our faith...)
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To: Black Agnes
I do absolutely comprehand what you’re writing.

Absolutely NOT. In fact, I am beginning to wonder if you are a little developmentally-disabled.

That the MSF CDC ‘collaboration’ is so good that MSF has apparently given the CDC regulations the finger and gone above and beyond those in order to keep their own people safe.

One.
More.
Freakin.
Time.
Because.
You.
Are.
Rock-Stupid.

THERE ARE NO CDC PROTOCOLS. THERE ARE NO MSF PROTOCOLS.

THERE ARE ONLY UNIVERSALLY-ACCEPTED PROTOCOLS THAT BOTH ORGANIZATIONS USE.

Jeez.

148 posted on 09/12/2014 10:33:05 AM PDT by Lazamataz (First we beat the Soviet Union. Then we became them.)
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To: Black Agnes
You’re the very one that said the level of protection depended on the ‘theater’.

Go educate yourself what the word means when related to infectious disease medicine.

149 posted on 09/12/2014 10:34:20 AM PDT by Lazamataz (First we beat the Soviet Union. Then we became them.)
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To: silverleaf
Flu season is just about to ramp up It may be interesting when someone who has the flu also gets ebola- maybe truly a virus marriage made in hell

And even worse the initial symptoms of Ebola are similar to the flu. How many people will be misdiagnosed initially?

150 posted on 09/12/2014 10:42:05 AM PDT by DouglasKC
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To: UCANSEE2
I figured that flatulence was just a gas (e.g. sulfur compound), not vapor. But you might be right: http://iuva.org/sites/default/files/member/news/IUVA_news/Vol10/Issue4/IUVANewsVol10_Issue4_04.pdf

Flatulence may explain how bacteria can get from the colon of operating room personnel into the open wound of a surgery patient.

151 posted on 09/12/2014 11:07:09 AM PDT by palmer (This comment is not approved or cleared by FDA)
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To: UCANSEE2
BUT YOU CAN, and every time you smell someone else's FART, you have inhaled particles of FECES.

Who is the smart feller and who is the fart smeller?

152 posted on 09/12/2014 11:37:59 AM PDT by Rodamala
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To: BunnySlippers
I still do not think it can take hold here like it can in Africa.

I don't know why not? ... The only differences I see between big swaths of the US and Africa are a few hippos and giraffes.

153 posted on 09/12/2014 3:09:23 PM PDT by The Duke
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To: Black Agnes; Lazamataz

I was referring to Laz’s use of ‘panicking’.

By the way, there is a new thread you might find very interesting.

Liberia: Somebody Had to Do It: Turning People Away [Ebola]
MSF.ORG ^ | 9/12/14 | msf
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3203381/posts


154 posted on 09/12/2014 3:23:24 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lost my tagline on Flight MH370. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: Black Agnes

So... what you are saying is that having adequate knowledge of the situation, and being prepared, is the proper response.

I have not advocated panicking, I think that ‘knowing’ as much as possible about the virus and it’s infection methods is of primary concern.

We agree. Others who accuse me of panicking are merely trying to ‘attack me’ as a way of defending their ignorance of the matter.

I, like you, have tried to give out information to others, and been criticized for doing so. They tell us we are wrong, yet they provide no proof.

So... I stick with my guns... BE PREPARED. WE CAN keep this from becoming an ‘outbreak’. The question is WILL WE ?


155 posted on 09/12/2014 3:36:53 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lost my tagline on Flight MH370. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: Black Agnes; Lazamataz
Because for here the cdc is saying ‘mask, gown and gloves’ is sufficient.

AND THAT's why I think the more info you have, the better prepared you are. Apparently the CDC has lost their mind.

How are ebola patients here different from ebola patients there?

They aren't. That's why your statement about the CDC saying you don't need as much protection 'here' seems insane.

Maybe the CDC is concerned about the 'optics' of wearing three layers of bio-hazard suits. It might give the public the idea that we are dealing with a very dangerous virus.

156 posted on 09/12/2014 3:46:25 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lost my tagline on Flight MH370. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: UCANSEE2

http://www.npr.org/blogs/goatsandsoda/2014/09/12/346114454/how-do-you-catch-ebola-by-air-sweat-or-water

Looks like WAY more than ‘mask, gloves and gown’ in that photo. If those are all that’s needed, why are they wasting all that money with extra protective gear? /s


157 posted on 09/12/2014 3:56:59 PM PDT by Black Agnes
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To: palmer

Thank you.

It is becoming more and more rare that posters actually look something up with a search engine and find out that I’m not just making this stuff up.


158 posted on 09/12/2014 4:06:27 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lost my tagline on Flight MH370. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: Black Agnes

First, thanks for posting that link. Everyone should read it.

Second, oh.... I just noticed your /s.

So.... never mind the second.


159 posted on 09/12/2014 4:09:53 PM PDT by UCANSEE2 (Lost my tagline on Flight MH370. Sorry for the inconvenience.)
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To: UCANSEE2

That’s a mockup of an ebola patient coming into the facility. They’re not even using ‘mask, gown and gloves’ only with the mock patient.


160 posted on 09/12/2014 4:11:35 PM PDT by Black Agnes
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