Posted on 10/31/2013 11:20:32 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
Edited on 10/31/2013 11:22:17 AM PDT by Admin Moderator. [history]
I’m not good at cowering...
Welcome - stay safe!
Judging by the responses on these threads in favor of killing the kid, I think that we are in the minority.
We’re surrounded. That simplifies the problem...
It wasn’t a legal shoot in my opinion.
Nor mine, but it was in the shooter’s opinion. Now all he has to do is follow the plan for shooting a kid with a BB gun that he came up with 8 years ago and he is home free.
Good point. Thanks.
No. I don't think so. Don't know if DC will agree, but ten years ago you would have been absolutely correct. Today, not so much. Many freepers have woken up to the danger of the police state.
Even if it was a real gun, and the kid didn’t shoot at the cop, the kid broke no law.
The cop should get the death penalty for murder.
To reiterate what I previously posted, the evidence will show that there are those on this forum that will defend the acts of the Einsatzgruppen groups in Eastern Europe during1940-41 just because they had the word “police” attached to them. In truth, the only thing more repugnant than what this cop did are those who defend him.
Despite being hit, kicked and almost bitten by the person, he [Gelhaus] used restraint and calm good judgment.
* * *
I saw that letter in today’s PD too. I don’t question Gelhaus’s bravery or his ability to persevere in the face of disheartening odds. I DO QUESTION his judgment. The bullets in the boy’s body were all in the right side except for the one in the left bicep. That plus the timeline (ten seconds from stopping the car to shooting the “suspect”) says to me that Andy Lopez didn’t remotely point his weapon AT the deputies; he simply started to turn around to see what was going on. I don’t even think the tip of his weapon “started to rise,” as Gelhaus claimed. I think, honestly, that was BS to support the deputy’s “I felt threatened” meme. I think he got trigger-happy out of fear or anxiety, and came up with “reasons” why he felt he “had” to shoot, after the fact.
As everyone should.
Everything he did put people at risk that day -- even his partner and the public.
He started firing while the car was still in motion and before his partner could prepare himself and take cover. I'm sure his partner with 11 years experience in LE was shocked by this.
Was he trying to show off his shooting skills to the new guy that he could hit a stationary target from a moving car??
And some of his rounds were recovered from within neighboring houses meaning that people in those houses were in the line of fire.
And regarding the gun pointing at him, all anyone needs to do to see which direction the rifle was pointing is take a stick or broom handle, put it in your left hand and then turn sideways to the right -- what's in your hand is the last thing to turn.
What was in Andy Lopez's hand was the last thing to turn as well and it was in no way threatening to the deputy.
Well, it was just a thought I had, which you clarified with your reply. . .that if the police vehicle doors were made bulletproof, could the boy have had more of a chance to live? This would of course depend on the mindset of the individual officer and perhaps the training in the future could be affected.
Would anyone with police experience be able to comment on the concept of vehicle door reinforcement?
I didn't know that, but I trust that you have been following this. I haven't kept up with subsequent articles, except one that said that the whole incident may have happened in less than 10 seconds including the 8 shots fired by the officer.
I don’t know if you’ve followed this incident in Santa Rosa, but as a New York City police officer could you comment on this idea about police taking cover behind their vehicle doors...
Would it make sense to reinforce inside the doors to make them bulletproof (steel or ceramic plates)? And then there is bulletproof glass...I guess it might be too expensive to be practical.
You’re not really taking cover behind the doors. They wont stop much of anything. What we’re taught to do is take cover behind the engine block, which usually means being behind a door. But the engine block is the key. If all you have is a door between you and an AK you’re in a bad spot.
Yep — his partner who has 11 years of LE experience said that by the time he stopped the vehicle and got out behind the door the target had been neutralized.
Here it is from the police spokesman from the article here:
By the time the deputy who was driving was able to pull across the intersection at West Robles Avenue and into the oncoming lane of Moorland Avenue, Gelhaus had already begun shooting at Lopez, Henry said.
“By the time the second deputy got out of the car, the subject was engaged and the threat was neutralized,” Henry said.
It’s possible Gelhaus got out of the patrol car before it completely stopped, Henry said today.
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