Posted on 10/04/2011 8:44:31 PM PDT by Meet the New Boss
I remember similar discussion. The comments I remember came down to questions about why these weapons did not have tracking devices at all. These weapons did not have any tracking devices. This told me that the purpose was not to track them, but to dump them into the drug underground so that it would create as much havoc as possible.
It is time we initiate the impeachment process now!
Thanks! I wonder. Does Sheriff Arpaio's jail hold federal prisoners? I think with all the trouble Holder and Obama have caused Joe he should get first crack at them.
>> Katie: “but those purchasers were immediately apprehended before crossing back into Mexico”
Details. Leftists don’t need no stinkin’ details.
They aren’t tracking devices if they don’t work.
They are just “other stuff”.
Saying they were “tracking devices” is pure BS. Unless my Taurus Wagon is an interstellar battlecruiser armed with photon torpedoes. Only - it isn’t. Even the warp drive doesn’t work. It is just fantasy.
“When Bush, a Republican, was president, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives in Tucson, Ariz., used a similar enforcement tactic in a program it called Operation Wide Receiver. The fact that there were two such ATF investigations years apart in separate administrations raises the possibility that agents in still other cases may have allowed guns to “walk.”
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We have been dealing with this Bush “Wide Receiver” connection on another thread. There is a link to Bush (if the source is accurate) AND a disconnect from Bush to Obama. If the source is correct, it needs to be acknowledged AND distinguished from Bush. I hope Freepers can follow the exchange below and comment.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2787817/posts?page=30#30
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“Is there any past reference to “Operation Wide Receiver”, “Wide Receiver” and Bush, or ATF, or firearms or ... ???
I cannot find anything, even in news archives.”
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That was my reason for my questions/article post 30. I am operating on the assumption that the DOJ has some “Wide Receiver” link to Bush, but if true, I question that the operation was conducted in the same manner. The info in post 30, if correct, suggests different methods.
The earliest ref to “Wide Receiver” that I can find is by Sharyl Attkisson on March 8, 2011:
Multiple sources now tell CBS News the questionable tactics were used in more than one operation, and date back as far as 2008 in the Tucson area. One case was called “Wide Receiver.”
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2011/03/08/eveningnews/main20040803.shtml
BUT, back to my post 30 source, dated June 2011. The first link links to this story:
http://www.theoutdoorwire.com/features/224570
In that article they say:
“Mounted approximately five [FIVE] years ago out of the Tucson office, Wide Receiver may have actually been the template used -with equally inept results- by the now-infamous Phoenix operations.
In Operation Wide Receiver, Tucson agents allowed the sales of more than 500 firearms to known straw purchasers. Like Gunrunner/Fast and Furious, the operation apparently backfired.
Some firearms in Wide Receive were equipped with RFID tracking devices. In Wide Receiver, it seems the illegal purchasers seemed more than slightly knowledgeable of the way the ATF and how to take their aerial and electronic tracking procedures down.”
http://www.theoutdoorwire.com/features/224570
MestaMachine (Posts 45, 46, 48): Per Maggief’s question:
Did you ever hear of “Wide Receiver” before Sharyl Attkisson mentioned it in March 2011?
Have you ever seen “Wide Receiver” in connection with GunRUNNER, rather than GunWALKER?
Take a look at Post 30 and the links:
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Thread source for this exchange:
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/2787817/posts?page=30#30
No device would have worked anyway. Either the batteries would die, it would get too far away to send a signal, they would dismantle or electronically sweep the gun and find it or it would just pass through so many hands it would be meaningless to follow its location. How would knowing its geographic location tell you who had it unless you pinpointed it to an exact address with known occupants? That doesn't seem likely in the vast stretches of Mexican desert where narco-traffickers probably don't put their own names on the deeds of the ranchos they operate out of.
Here the agents who were part of the operation say themselves that they had no chance at all of following those guns until they showed up at a crime scene. That's why they are whistleblowers. They saw nothing but death and destruction coming out of it. ATF report
Convict ‘em put ‘em out in the desert and let Mexico chase them down with a Predator drone. Sheriff Joe can drive them towards the Mexican border like cattle. Everybody gets their shot at them.
Regarding “Wide Receiver” and Pres. Bush let me just ask this; with all the field agents coming forward as whistle blowers because they were so disgusted with these gun walking operations why hasn’t a single one of them ever mentioned either Wide Receiver or Pres. Bush?
I can’t answer that; I am just operating on the assumption that the “leak” is accurately representing that the DOJ has a tie linking the Bush Adm and Obama Adm to “Wide Receiver.”
And I happened to find this source confirming a link. If it is true (and I have no confidence in this source
http://www.theoutdoorwire.com/features/224570
UNLESS it is confirmed), my argument and my understanding, were it confirmed to be true, is that Bush handled Wide Receiver entirely differently than the Obama Adm.
Bush, according to the article, actually TRACKED weapons with RFID’s, and when the method and operation failed, he shut it down.
We have NO evidence, to my knowledge, that the Obama Adm EVER tried to track a single weapon that they let “walk.”
Furthermore, I would maintain the Bush Adm motive was entirely different than the Obama Adm motive.
I assert that the motive of Obama & Thugs, Inc was to destabilize Mexico and bordering US states. Secondarily, (because they always like to kill as many birds with one stone as possible), they wanted to strengthen their position to attack the 2nd amendment and get guns out of the hands of US citizens.
It was essentially a rhetorical question.
According to the definition of "walking" that the four ATF agents give you can't track a weapon that walks. The definition of "walking" is that it gets out of their control.
“It was essentially a rhetorical question.”
lol; I spent all that time crafting a response to a rhetorical question?
I have appreciated our exchanges.
My GOD, someone else finally gets it. These guys think no lie is too big or too small to tell. The bigger lies are apparently more fun.
If you want to understand American History for the last few decades, understand that message, no lie is too big or too small to tell. Americans are idiots and will believe anything they are told.
Anything.
The audio tapes already show they did not intend to track them
“According to the definition of “walking” that the four ATF agents give you can’t track a weapon that walks. The definition of “walking” is that it gets out of their control.”
That might be an important distinction that the Obama Adm might be trying to muddle.
“you can’t track a weapon that walks. The definition of “walking” is that it gets out of their control.”
But still not clear.
What if you RFID weapons with every intention to track them and your plan is foiled by the bad guys VS You let loose weapons with no tracking system in place? Bush method vs Obama method.
“According to the definition of “walking” that the four ATF agents give”
...would BOTH of those scenarios be considered “gunwalking”?
Curious that after months of ignoring a story bigger than Watergate - Watergate with a freaking body count, that Barack’s own propaganda arm is suddenly jumping into the fray.
Things that make you go hmmmmm
would Obama pull the Nuclear option strategy to save his sorry ass by threatening to pull down the Republicans who were gunrunning before he was? Did they?
Was their little news response about Bush starting the program a shot accross the bow?
Getting interesting. Shades of Clinton.
It was a good response FWIW. lol I know how you feel, I spent an hour trying to find the agent’s quote about tracking devices to convince another poster I hadn’t made it up and came back to find he hadn’t meant to imply he didn’t believe me.
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