Posted on 02/24/2011 7:59:35 AM PST by SeekAndFind
I think this guy lives as far in the dream world on one side of the spectrum as unions are on the other.
There is another side to this which I have never heard discussed. When I worked for a company, they sold my labor with generally a 150% markup to a customer. If I was worth that much, a certain percentage could be used to pay me when I “retired”.
The other fact is that as population grows the society has to produce jobs for the young workers to have. A culture which does not do this is deficient. This was one of the strengths of the US for two centuries - the were jobs for anyone that wanted to work. Now we have countries which tell their young professionals, if they want to work they will have to immigrate. This is unconscionable.
Why?
A better question is why people expect to have a second childhood where someone else takes care of them. Life, on average, doesn’t work that way.
I will never retire. It won’t be an option. I fear that most boomers haven’t realized that they will be in the same boat.
I think the guy is right. The new retiremente paradigm: work til you drop. Even the Bible says: don’t work, don’t eat. We may see a return of the “workhouse”.
You never want to discourage people from working by subsidizing joblessness (unemployment, retirement, etc).
Not just you, but your place of work, your insurance, your other half of medicare and SS, the equipment you used, etc...
It wasn't 50% profit. Providing for ourselves should be our responsibility from the beginning. To be decades later and suddenly decide we are owed more now doesn't sound like a conservative viewpoint.
The other fact is that as population grows the society has to produce jobs for the young workers to have.
Really, this is "society's job"? There was a time when someone old enough to work sought ought was was desired and tried to provide that, either services or products.
“Stephen Mauzy is a financial writer, analyst, and principal of S.P. Mauzy & Associates”
Mr. Mauzy, try working 40 years as a bricklayer.
Then see if you believe “a leisurely retirment” might be “practical or desirable”.
Till then, most of what you wrote is crap.
And this is exactly why attempts to “raise the retirement age” are going to become political poison to those who keep carping on the idea.
Whatever is wrong with Social Security and the other retirement systems, they aren’t going to be “fixed” that way. And them that tries to do so are gonna find themselves thrown out on their behinds faster than you can say “outta here”!
Pensions that are not actuarially sound - are the equivalent of a free lunch and we all know such do not exist. There are plenty of Madoff types out there (many of whom look alarmingly like your local politician who promises chickens in every pot) - so one is wise to spread one’s risks and diligently plan for an uncertain future.
As to the the notion that one should “work” until the one keels over - that is plainly ridiculous. That one should remain active, mentally and physically, makes sense. I retired early (@ 60 )and I find that I have so much to do that I can barely find the time to do my “honey does”.
How we take care of those in need defines us as a society. The elderly poor can never be abandoned, but we CAN begin to fix SS simply by means-testing it now. I know the attacks begin when I say this, but I don’t care.
It is NOT “my money”: I’m sorry we were lied to, but some of us knew from day one that it WAS a lie. It IS a tax on the generations behind us, just as it was a tax on us. “Our” money is long gone to support those who retired before us.
If you were smart enough to have a private retirement account, good for you for being so smart! But if that account allows you an income above a certain amount, then you don’t NEED SS. And we, our generation, have NO right to burden our kids in this way.
Means testing is a way to start, slowly, abolishing SS. No one above a certain amount (I’ll leave that to smarter folks to decide) should be receiving this entitlement.
One hundred years ago the average life expectancy for those who reached 18 years of age was 62. Now people are living much longer. So how do we care for them when they can't work. Do we put it all on the family? Or do we run government financed old age homes?
It seems alot of freepers would go with the former. They are very libertarian when it comes to pensions and such.
The problem is the old paradigm still reigns... work to pay for the freeloaders.
I know MANY people who have absolutely no retirement savings (except for the promise of Social Security). Now there is a call to means test SS... where does that leave those people?- no SS but continue working until you drop to pay for the freeloaders... and also the people who did manage to save- no SS but continue working to pay for the freeloaders. Unless entitlements stop most of us will be on the treadmill paying for everyone else until we drop.
The new paradigm needs to be- don’t work, don’t eat.
Social Security was initially sold to the public as a safety net to provide a bare subsistence in the last few years of life to workers who could no longer work and who did not have families that could take care of them. Like most government programs, it quickly expanded into a huge Ponzi scheme/entitlement program.
Social Security and most government pension programs rely upon the assumption that you will have a perpetually growing pool of current workers to pay for the retired workers. When the pool of current workers outnumber the retired workers by 4/1 or more, the scheme can stay afloat. When the ratio of workers to retirees drops to 2/1 or 1/1 (as it is now), the Ponzi scheme collapses.
I don't admire them as much as I once did. I know one guy who has been dishing in the bucks for 15 years now. The day he and his wife were able to add Social Security to his take was another big celebration at his house.
His pension is public, and so is hers. With SS added in, they buy new Mercedes cars that I could only dream about, and take at least two cruises or European vacations a year. Every time I go to his house, he has a contractor working to add on this or renovate that.
If he were making his big bucks from a business he sold or something, I would applaud it all. But it just seems wrong, and it is.
“But if that account allows you an income above a certain amount, then you don’t NEED SS”
Is that you, Barry? After all, didn’t you say that after a certain amount of money you don’t need any more? I thought so, komrade
Explain why you think you are owed my money komrade.
Explain why you think that we should support those who can support themselves komrade.
There is no trust fund, and no money in SS. It is a tax.
Aren't all Federal Pensions basically funded by our current taxes?
Should we be applying means testing you want to apply to Social Security to other Federal Pensions including Military Pensions?
I do not want your money. I want my money. The money that I paid into SS. Give it back. I will go away. Oh, it’s not there? Who is responsible for it not being there? Isn’t that called robbery when someone steals/appropriates money?
Why should we support those who can support themselves? Hey, you tell me... we’re already doing it through every entitlement program out there.
EXACTLY. All fed and military pensions are paid by taxes.
Means test SS? Then that would also entail means testing of fed and military pensions, right?
I am so amazed that a conservative site is filled with so many people calling for means testing SS... instead of calling for the elimination of entitlements, these conservatives want to create another one!! OMGosh!!
Not to long ago several generations of a family liced together, usually on the family farm.
They took care of each other. Grandparents helped raise the grandkids, the middle generation worked the farm and other jobs.
What was so wrong with that? Now, if a kid is 22 and lives at home, people think there’s something wrong with him, and we pitch our older folks into nursing homes and think nothing of it.
“lived”
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