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Old left-right model has failed us badly
Aberdeen American News ^ | May 28, 2010 | Art Marmorstein

Posted on 05/28/2010 9:49:18 AM PDT by ancientart

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To: ancientart

Here was my take on it from back in January of 09’. After I wrote this it wasn’t long before Glen Beck was stating something similar on his show.

All Scales Measure Something So What Should a Political Scale Measure? -

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2161922/posts


21 posted on 05/28/2010 10:26:18 AM PDT by TheBigIf
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To: ancientart

The left/right fallacy was created by the commies and their usefull idiots at the NY Times after Hitler attacked the Russians - they needed to explain away their former alliance between the Nazis and Commies.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DyU4GfqF54o&eurl=http%3A%2F%2Fvideo%2Egoogle%2Ecom%2Fvideosearch%3Fq%3Dnazis%2Bsoviets%2Bpoland%26hl%3Den%26emb%3D0%26aq%3Df&feature=player_embedded


22 posted on 05/28/2010 10:27:38 AM PDT by BloodnGuts
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To: ancientart
No, the left-right spectrum is just fine. It's the misapplication and dishonest abuse of that spectrum which has caused all the confusion.

Naziism, fascism, communism, marxism and socialism are all various points on the left end of the spectrum.

One of the most pervasive, perpetual and damaging lies of my lifetime is that the Nazis were right-wing.

23 posted on 05/28/2010 10:28:33 AM PDT by TChris ("Hello", the politician lied.)
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To: ancientart
What part of "National Socialist German Workers’ Party" doesn't sound like it belongs on the left?

. . . identify the extreme left in this country with Communism. The leftist fringe still calls for the old Marxist platform, things like an end to most private property, redistribution of wealth and government ownership of banks and utilities. Many on the left (particularly in the academic world) quite openly express their allegiance to the Marxist agenda.

Obama and Pelosi want to ignore contract law for mortgages facing foreclosure, nationalize the banks and auto manufacturing along with other large businesses, and redistribute the wealth because that's "good for everyone". Is there any difference at all between our Dear Leader and a communist on the extreme . . . leftist fringe?

24 posted on 05/28/2010 10:52:34 AM PDT by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: Personal Responsibility

That’s the spectrum I see. It’s freedom v. totalitarianism, and Obama is not on the side that protects individual freedom.


25 posted on 05/28/2010 10:56:11 AM PDT by Pollster1 (Natural born citizen of the USA, with the birth certificate to prove it)
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To: ancientart

The writer fundamentally goes off the tracks by identifying Communism on one end of the spectrum and national socialism (Nazi) on the other. They are both socialist ideologies.


26 posted on 05/28/2010 11:03:40 AM PDT by RobinOfKingston (Democrats, the party of evil. Republicans, the party of stupid.)
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To: DugwayDuke

Exactly right. Nazis and Fascists sprang from the political left, not the right. The traditional “conservative right” in Europe is aristocratic/Christian/monarchist, not Nazi or Fascist.

The only reason that modern society thinks of Nazis and Fascists as “right wing” is that during WW II the Communists said they were right-wing. Examine the policies and you will discover that they both wanted the same things and used many of the same tactics and slogans to get what they wanted. A wise author once said that Nazism was national communism, and communism is international Nazism. In this context, the Nazi/Soviet war was less a clash of ideologies than a left-wing civil war.


27 posted on 05/28/2010 11:10:03 AM PDT by happyathome
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To: ancientart
The best definition I've seen in the last couple years is at www.wimp.com.
28 posted on 05/28/2010 11:13:01 AM PDT by MCH
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To: ancientart
"You and I are told increasingly we have to choose between a left or right. Well I'd like to suggest there is no such thing as a left or right. There's only an up or down—[up] man's old—old-aged dream, the ultimate in individual freedom consistent with law and order, or down to the ant heap of totalitarianism. And regardless of their sincerity, their humanitarian motives, those who would trade our freedom for security have embarked on this downward course."

- Ronald Reagan: A TIME FOR CHOOSING (October 27, 1964)

Wiki

YouTube

29 posted on 05/28/2010 11:50:05 AM PDT by Theophilus (Not merely prolife, but prolific!)
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To: ancientart

The constitutional model. No exceptions or it’s treason.


30 posted on 05/28/2010 2:04:34 PM PDT by SaraJohnson
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To: TheBigIf

Very helpful! Thanks, TBI


31 posted on 05/28/2010 2:55:06 PM PDT by ancientart (Dems: The party who booed the Boy Scouts off the stage at the 2004 convention)
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To: ancientart
During the period between the two world wars, it made good sense to think of the political spectrum as extending between two totalitarian extremes, with totalitarian Communism on the left and totalitarian fascism and national socialism on the right. The Spanish Civil War and the street battles between Communists and Nazis in Weimar Germany did in fact take place in societies where many (if not most) were drifting toward one totalitarian pole or another.
No it didn't. F Hayek noted that in Weimar Germany, Nazis and Communists may have fought, but it was a turf war, because they we competing for that same thing, followers of the collectivist mind set. Followers of one could become followers of the other.

Their basic enemy was the supporter of individual liberty - Western Liberal Democracy as it was then - who could noyt be a collectivist.

32 posted on 05/28/2010 5:01:08 PM PDT by Oztrich Boy (May 15: It's Jessica Watson Day!)
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To: omega4412

True, take Trotsky versus Stalin for excample. In a 2D model they will be standing next to each other. The difference in a 3D model will be obvious since the latter is far more isolationistic than the former. The same counts for Paleo- versus Neo conservatism.


33 posted on 06/02/2010 6:02:59 AM PDT by Tocq
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