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In Soviet Hell and the blasted avenues of Mogadishu, I saw what our society could become
Daily Mail ^ | 13th March 2010 | Peter Hitchens

Posted on 03/13/2010 12:26:55 PM PST by Brugmansian

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To: Persevero
What is God, then?

Which one?

41 posted on 03/15/2010 1:04:37 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

Well, you said you don’t believe in God. I am asking you to define what it is you don’t believe in.

A Creator? A Sustainer? A Savior? A Judge? What do you consider “God” to be?


42 posted on 03/15/2010 2:14:38 PM PDT by Persevero ("Our culture is far better than a retarded Islamic culture." -Geert Wilders)
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To: Brugmansian; DuncanWaring

Excellent primer on communism and anarchy, and the fragility of western civ.


43 posted on 03/15/2010 3:08:50 PM PDT by Travis McGee (---www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com---)
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To: Travis McGee

Saw it.

Preview of Coming Attractions.


44 posted on 03/15/2010 3:31:20 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: DuncanWaring

I sure hope not, not either version of hell.


45 posted on 03/15/2010 3:31:58 PM PDT by Travis McGee (---www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com---)
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To: Travis McGee

I just must have a cheerier disposition than you. ;-)

That situations that article describes aren’t a whole lot different than some described in Domestic Enemies.


46 posted on 03/15/2010 3:35:29 PM PDT by DuncanWaring (The Lord uses the good ones; the bad ones use the Lord.)
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To: Persevero
Well, you said you don’t believe in God.

That wording presupposes that there exists a Christian God and I don't believe. Better to say I lack belief in any of the thousands of deities that have been created by cultures throughout history, however they were defined, whatever roles (creator, savior, messenger, carting the Sun across the horizon) they were given.

47 posted on 03/15/2010 6:25:42 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

Yes, my wording does presuppose that there exists a God, anyway.

Atheism presupposes that a God doesn’t exist.

There is a presupposition either way.

That’s where I am trying to get to.

I was an atheist for some time. So I have some familiarity with atheist thinking.

I do presuppose, and it is a faith to presuppose, that there is a God. You do presuppose, and it is a faith to presuppose, that there is not.


48 posted on 03/15/2010 8:45:18 PM PDT by Persevero ("Our culture is far better than a retarded Islamic culture." -Geert Wilders)
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To: Persevero
Atheism presupposes that a God doesn’t exist.

Not necessarily correct. At a personal level it can be just a lack of belief in deities, not a positive statement, "strong" vs. "weak" atheism.

I was an atheist for some time. So I have some familiarity with atheist thinking.

You may have been suckered by Dawkins and his ilk who practically turn atheism into its own religion when it doesn't need to be. Even if you turned religious, congratulations for getting out from under their negative philosophy.

49 posted on 03/16/2010 5:11:16 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

I have never read anything by Dawkins.

I think a denial of God is impossible.

You are always obeying somebody, if only Yourself. You always have a moral code, no matter how repugnant. You always are in a physical state, created obviously by someone or something (no one creates himself). You have a belief about the state of your existence after death, even if you believe you simply dissolve into dirt.

You either believe God is eternal; or you believe matter is; or you believe you can’t know; either way, it is a belief.

Even Satan is not an atheist. He hates God, yes, but he doesn’t disbelieve in His existence.


50 posted on 03/16/2010 8:36:01 PM PDT by Persevero ("Our culture is far better than a retarded Islamic culture." -Geert Wilders)
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To: Persevero
You either believe God is eternal; or you believe matter is; or you believe you can’t know; either way, it is a belief.

You're equating believing anything to be a religion. It is lack of belief. Really it's the old saying: An atheist just lacks belief in one more god than a Christian does.

It's a skeptical position. Nobody has supported their claim for the existence of their god well enough for me to accept it as true. Do I ascribe some kind of "belief" to you for not believing in the Invisible Pink Unicorn (PBUHH)? No, I'd think you're a skeptic who'd demand I show She exists, otherwise you're not believing.

51 posted on 03/16/2010 8:49:03 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

No, I am a believer, just like everyone else.

I think you are a believer, at the risk of repeating myself. That is how I see you.

You just trust in someone that I don’t trust in. My guess is it’s You. But I don’t know you well enough to know for sure.


52 posted on 03/16/2010 9:15:29 PM PDT by Persevero ("Our culture is far better than a retarded Islamic culture." -Geert Wilders)
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To: Persevero
I think you are a believer, at the risk of repeating myself. That is how I see you.

Still the problem of painting someone else with your worldview. Not everyone deems belief necessary.

53 posted on 03/16/2010 10:17:08 PM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

“Not everyone deems belief necessary.”

That is a belief.


54 posted on 03/16/2010 10:51:02 PM PDT by Persevero ("Our culture is far better than a retarded Islamic culture." -Geert Wilders)
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To: Persevero

That is an opinion.


55 posted on 03/17/2010 5:03:21 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

Yes, but I own my opinions/beliefs as such. You don’t.


56 posted on 03/17/2010 12:13:09 PM PDT by Persevero ("Our culture is far better than a retarded Islamic culture." -Geert Wilders)
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To: Persevero
Yes, but I own my opinions/beliefs as such. You don’t.

You pulled a belief package off the shelf.

57 posted on 03/18/2010 6:11:00 AM PDT by antiRepublicrat
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