Is the H1N1 Swine Flu Vaccine Safe?

Web MD ^ | Oct 20, 2009 | Daniel J. DeNoon

[dangerdoc]

I survived the flu shot and the H1N1 flumist. Do I get some koolaide too?

[Caesar Soze]

I asked my physician why the FDA did not approve the swine flu vaccine. He told me they did approve it. I checked. He was right. It was approved after they waived all of the qualification testing. This is as hoaky as it gets. Next question: Why were the qual tests waived?

The novel H1N1 vaccine is the same thing as the seasonal vaccine that has been tested and widely used for years. It's simply a monovalent version, while the seasonal is trivalent (targeting one virus vs. three).

The World Health Organization predicts which three flu strains will be most likely before a given flu season, and its recommendations are followed for the seasonal flu shot. Every year it selects an H1N1 strain, an H3N2 strain, and a B strain. The base of the flu vaccine is always the same, only the viral material targeted changes based on the WHO's recommendations. This year, WHO made its recommendations in February, then the swine flu outbreak occurred in April.

Since it was too late to alter the seasonal flu schedule, a "new" vaccine had to be developed for novel H1N1. But it's not really new at all: It's the same base as the seasonal flu shot, but with a different strain of H1N1 and no material from H3N2 or B. Had WHO waited a few months, or had the swine flu outbreak occurred earlier, novel H1N1 would have been included in the seasonal shot.

So there's really no reason for substantial tests. The base of the vaccine has been proven throughout the world for a number of years, and the same experience tells us that altering the targeted flu strain does not cause any unexpected changes. It simply changes which strain the vaccine protects against. (And I don't think seasonal vaccines are regularly tested, although I could be wrong.)

[Scythian]

Let’s see where you’re at in a month, then we’ll know ...

[Ben Mugged]

The H1N1 that was supposedly tested via a mock vaccine and some that will be made in china

Can you point me at a reference? By the way, you know why the vaccine is not produced in America? Hillary Clinton drove the commercial manufacturers out of business.

I am not trying to convince folks either way. I only want them to make an informed decision not one based on innuendo and rumor.

[TSgt]

Dr. Scythian obviously has a doctorate in pharmacology like my spouse.

The difference is that he printed his from the internet.

I hear he’s also a reverend and has his MBA.

[Scythian]

Can you point me at a reference?

No, I wont, it's rediculous that folks aren't aware of this information yet are running to get injected, google is your friend. 1) One of the manufacturers of the 5 that make the vaccines is a Chinese company in China 2) They didn't have time to test the actual vaccine, so they did mock testing, that's a fact. Now, when you consider that Baxter sent the live virus to something like 18 countries (it was the bird flu I think they were all worried about too) to be used that is frightening. One of the countries discovered it thankfully and saved a massive pandemic from occuring, and that this year, testing matters ...

[TSgt]

Dr. Scythian.

FWIW - I work in clinical trials for a global company.

[mysterio]

Getting the shot myself as soon as I can find a dose of it.

[Proud_texan]

"A few days or a week later"

I am hardly an expert and you should by no means take this as a fact but it is my understanding that it takes a least a week for the flu vaccine to be effective. I also understand that there is a lag time between the time you "catch" the flu and become symptomatic so there's a good chance (if the above is true) that you already had the flu when you got the shot.

I mention this because the same thing happened to me many years ago so I dropped getting the shot. Then after having the flu for a couple of years in a row I started the shots again, getting them as early in the season as they were available, and haven't had the flu since.

I understand your decision and by no means am I trying to change your mind, I only mention this just in case you want to do more research because yeow, those couple of cases of flu I had were brutal and it took me weeks before I got back to whatever passes for normal for me.

[dangerdoc]

I’ll be here, I’ve received the flu vaccine every year for the last 25 years.

[dangerdoc]

The flu shot cannot give you the flu, on the other hand, it takes a few weeks to build up the protective antibodies.

It sounds like bad timing.

[agrace]

How were your symptoms?

I never get sick - never had the flu (nor the flu shot), colds never settle in (I may have a day of post nasal drip/sore throat that goes away), rarely get stomach illnesses, or if I do they are more mild than the rest of my family, so my immune system is great.

Anyway, that said, about a month ago I got a bad sore throat, slight fever (I never have a fever either), lots of fatigue for a couple days running, and the sore throat turned into a horrendous mostly dry cough that lasted for several weeks. I STILL have a cough - feel fine, but traces of the cough and some slight mucus remain. And I never got congested in my face.

Weirdest few weeks I’ve ever had with regard to illness. So I’m curious as to what it actually was (I didn’t go to the dr). I’ve joked that it was swine flu, but maybe it was. :)

[dangerdoc]

How sick you feel with an infection is directly related to the strength of the immune reaction, not the virus itself.

On one hand not getting sick with the viruses is a blessing, on the other hand, people who never feel sick are statistically at slightly higher risk for cancer.

I kind of get a kick out of all the products to “build up the immune system”, if they were actually making the immune system more potent, they would cause more symptoms with the inevitable viral infections which we all get.

Based on your description, I would not be surprised in the least if you did have the flu.

[Kakaze]

Agrace, I normally will have a day with fever, break it 3 or 4 times and ge tup the next morning with no problems.

This year I had 3 days of flu, even my fingers hurt, then a week with no symptoms and felt fine.

Now a deep cough but no fever, from what I understand it is the secondary fever you have to watch for.

Now I am 43 ,in the bracket to get this severely, my flight surgeon ( 75)told me , I'm the prime target for this, the emergency rooms and ICU in NM are full........half are pre-existing the other half, the sickest half are like me.

My wife, who is older has only the cough.

I hope this helps.

[ridesthemiles]

I won’t take either.

[agrace]

It does help, thank you. I’d be curious to know how long your cough lasts. If mine is the same, deep is certainly a good word for it. I have read that lots of H1N1 patients have lingering coughs. I’m 41 and in that same bracket, but maybe my immune system saved me from the worst of things like usual.

And speaking of age brackets, my 6 & 8 yr old didn’t get sick at all, my 12 yr old coughed for several days, but my husband got pretty sick, felt bad longer, and still has traces of cough too.

Maybe it WAS H1N1. Although even if I could check at this point, I hear that they’re seeing so many cases that they’re not doing the specific test anymore.

[agrace]

...on the other hand, people who never feel sick are statistically at slightly higher risk for cancer.

That's a little disconcerting. :) Has anyone investigated why that might be?

[granite]

Epidemic Influenza And Vitamin D

 

[granite]

Epidemic Influenza And Vitamin D

 

[dangerdoc]

The same type of immune reaction that makes you ill with a virus is involved in killing cells that are turning malignant. The effect is minimal, I wouldn’t lose any sleep over it.

The professor was talking about it as a trade off for all of those days in misery with colds.