Posted on 09/28/2009 8:12:21 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
lol
It is a position based on the authority of God’s Word and not man’s limited intelligence. Jesus said “from the beginning He created them male and female.” Are you suggesting that humans have been around for millions of years. Or are you suggesting that Jesus didn’t know what he was talking about?
I have to give it to 3G, he can outbluster anyone else here. The trouble is bluster is all it is.
Fortunately, the advancement of human knowledge is not based on who can scream the loudest.
Then why did Peter tell us how long a day with the LORD is as a thousand years, if Exodus 20 is so clear? Peter says there are three different heaven/earth ages. The one that WAS, the one that is now and the one yet to come. Take into consideration how long Methuselah lived nearly ONE day with the LORD. Then the Heavenly Father cut short the time allow for the flesh body to live. Genesis 6. Oh and you can find what Peter told us NOT to be ignorant about in IIPeter 3... The whole chapter, and Peter says that this information was also told to us by the holy prophets, and that would included Moses as he penned Genesis as well as Exodus.
Moses was teaching these 'children' fresh out of Egyptian bondage the WORD and as Paul says one must start with the milk of the WORD before the meat is digestible.
Yes, humans have been around in their modern form for around 100,000 years. And no, they didn't coexist with dinosaurs.
But have a Yabba Dabba Doo day, nonetheless.
Discovering the mechanisms whereby Stars form does not remove God as their creator. Right now a star is forming from a gas cloud. God created that star just as much as HE created our Star, and possibly using the exact same mechanisms. It didn't have to be mysteriously magical for it to be a manifestation of God's will and creative power.
Similarly, discovering the mechanisms whereby species form does not in any way remove God as their creator. Right now a new species is branching off from an ancestral population. God created that species just as much as HE created our own.
How can you say that God "waited"? Isn't God omnipotent? He can and has caused time to completely stop (see Joshua 10:23) and run backwards (see 2 Kings 20:9-11). He is also capable of accelerating it to an infinite rate and of making it a completely irrelevant non-factor.
Your problem is that you have accepted the position of GGG in that a yom, in the context of creation, is a standard 24 hour earth day. That wrongly implies or imposes limitations on God that are not supported in Genesis or through the fuller definition of God. You have also (wrongly) taken GGGs position that not agreeing with you is deflection.
The scripture says that a day is like a thousand years and that a THOUSAND YEARS IS LIKE A DAY. The last part of the verse would cancel out the first part of the verse if this was meant to be literal. The verse is speaking of God not being bound by time. The rest of the passage goes on to say that God is not slack concerning His promise as some count slackness. IOW, don’t be impatient God is not on YOUR timetable. It has nothing to do with the scripture in Genesis or in Exodus. The information that was spoken about by the prophets was that the world perished in a flood and that in the end times there would be scoffers who deny this. I still don’t understand the point you are making about flesh body and Methusaleh and the shortening of the days of man. That was a prophecy about the coming flood not about shorter life spans for people. Any way I am finished with this discussion because I have said everything already and you can read the posts from before. Blessings.
I am sorry I thought I was talking with someone who believed the Bible. I won’t post to you again on the subject.
I didn’t impose anything on God. I have only limited Him to His Word. I took Him at His Word and believed what He said He did. I got none of this from GGG. You are the one putting God in a box. He COULD have done anything. But I believe what HE SAID that HE did. How can I say that God waited? The Bible says He created plants and the evening and morning were the first day. Then the next day he created the sun moon and stars and evening and morning were the fourth day. He didn’t do it all on day one ie He waited until the next day to create the next thing. Do you suppose it took Him all day and night to create the things on one day and as soon as it was the next day, He started on the next thing? If not, then you believe He waited too.
“You have also (wrongly) taken GGGs position that not agreeing with you is deflection.”
You can agree with me all you want. You however are deflecting when I ask you a specific question repeatedly and you do not answer it or you attempt to answer it like a politican. Ex. I asked you what was wrong with the rules of exegesis that I was using and you said my conclusion was wrong. I was trying to establish what rules you would accept to further the debate and you refuse to answer the specific question. Also I had to ask the question about Exodus 20 several times and you really never answered it but gave a flawed analogy about two dogs. So IOW you are deflecting whether you agree with me or not. I am having another discussion in this thread with an evolutionist. He obviously doesn’t agree with me but he isn’t deflecting my questions. I am enjoying the exchange immensely. This exchange however is exhausting and this is my last post to you and the others that are talking about yom.
LOL! That should read “you can DISagree with me all you want.”
Here are the exact WORDS from my King James (which I prefer because I can source the meaning of the word, and the other meanings the word can have and where else that particular word is used in Scripture)
IIPeter 3:8 But, beloved, be NOT ignorant of this one thing, (Literally means let not this one thing be hidden from you)
that one day is (the word is in my King James is in italics) with the LORD as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day.
I did not see in your response that part about with the LORD
Now Peter gives this accounting of time of the length of a *day* with the LORD right after he says there are three different heaven/earth ages in verses 5,6&7.
But of course the Heavenly Father is NOT bound by OUR time, but your description is how the traditions of man describe what Peter tells us that was also told by the holy prophets from chapter 3:2.
Peter is reminding us what Jeremiah the holy prophet penned in Jeremiah 4:22 -27. Jeremiah like Peter is NOT talking about Noah's flood, they both are referring to Genesis 1:2 "And the earth *became* (some translator/scribe injected that word *was*) without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep.
Deep WHAT?
I just don't put much stock in your interpretation of it. But then again neither does the mainstream of Christian thought for a long time.
“The truth of our faith becomes a matter of ridicule among the infidels if any Catholic, not gifted with the necessary scientific learning, presents as dogma what scientific scrutiny shows to be false.”
Thomas Aquinas
“...there is much scientific proof in favor of evolution, which appears as a reality that we must see and which enriches our understanding of life and being as such.” Pope Benedict XVI
I am sorry that wasn’t meant as a slam but when you came back with the God used evolution argument I thought that you didn’t believe what the Bible said. I didn’t mean to insult you. End of discussion for me but didn’t want to leave you with the feeling that I had insulted you on purpose.
Do you think that most of the Christian world, that has no problems with scientific theory, doesn't believe the Bible?
I think you like to believe in yourself rather than God.
v 6 whereby the world that then was being overflowed with water perished
That isn’t talking about the flood?
Three different earth/heaven ages?
the world that was - the past
the world that now is - the present
the world that is reserved- the future
It isn’t speaking of three different ages of earth and heaven but of the past present and future.
I do not think that the Pope believes in Creation as recorded in Genesis. It really isn’t open to much interpretation. It is written as history. The timeline of evolution is in direct conflict with the timeline of creation week. Evolution says sun before earth, creation says earth before sun etc. I put no faith in myself at all. Similarly people who accept “scientific” ideas that are contrary to the clear teaching of biblical history, believe more in the intelligence of man than in the infallibility of God and His Word. Genesis is written history clear and plain. To allegorize it in the beginning is not consistent. When does it stop being allegory and become the true history of the nation of Israel?
That is exactly the answer I wanted to give. It was in no way a dodge. Hermaneutics isn't a computer program you can feed scripture into and get an interpretation out of. Hermaneutics is only a tool that will give the user right results if applied correctly and supported with knowledge of both the original languages and the supporting sciences. Just as knowledge of the rules of grammar will not result literary talent or success the knowledge of the rules of hermaneutics will not lead to the correct conclusions.
Sorry I keep trying to get out of this discussion but I keep getting sucked back in. LOL! Good discussion but it is becoming exhausting. I have been sick today and had a day off from home school so I have done pretty much nothing but FR.
You said we were playing by different rules and I was trying to play by yours so we could further the discussion. You want to play games and continue to. Goodnight!
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