Posted on 09/09/2008 4:30:18 PM PDT by Paul Ross
I agree to an extent.
500 isn’t enough though, I say a nice round 600 with a fully refurbished “Golden Eagle” force of 200.
I also say that the Air Force would be better off stripping the F-22 of it’s bomb dropping capability and persuing the FB-22 variant to replace the F-15E.
The enormous cost of the current aircraft is because of 2 reasons. The first is that the Air Force keeps screwing around and adding capabilities to the aircraft that are beyond the original intent of the design which is air superiority. The second and by far biggest reason why they cost so much is because the congresscritters (and some Air Force bean counters) decided that there needs to only be 183 F-22’s in service. The limited production run means higher cost per airframe.....That’s why a Ferrari for example costs $450,000 and a Ford costs $25,000.
Elect McWhatshisname/Palin, and just maybe we’ll get more F-22’s funded.
Elect Obozo and there will be no new F-22’s, plus Obammy would prolly give the ones we have to Hamass
“Dear Bobalu You are wrong fighters never stay in service longer than 4-6 years”
The F-4 Phantom was produced from 1958 until 1981 with 5,195 aircraft built. There are still well over 500 aircraft in service.
The F-4 first entered service with the U.S. Navy in 1960. In 1987, the last Naval Reserve F-4’s were replaced, and the last F-4’s in Navy service (QF-4 drones) were finally retired in 2004.....44 years (27 active)
The F-4 entered service with the U.S. Marine Corps in June 1962, and the last were retired in January 1992....30 years.
The F-4 entered service with the U.S. Air Force in 1963, and the last operational flight was in 1996. The F-4 is currently still in use with the Air Force as the QF-4, and is expected to see operations until 2014.... a projected 51 years (36 active).
The F-14 entered service in 1974, and was retired in 2006 after 32 years.
The F-111 entered service in 1967, and the last ones were retired from U.S. service in 1998. Australia is still flying the F-111 and will retire them in 2010 after 27 years of service.
The F/A-18C/D are over 20 years old and is still in service.
Then there are other aircraft such as the Mig-21 which first entered service in 1959 and is still in service in vast numbers.
If anything has been a waste of money, it’s proving to be the F-35.
And no, you can’t buy 4 F-35’s for the cost of 1 F-22 even if the F-35 still cost the $80 million as promised it would be impossible.....Heck you couldn’t even buy 2 F-35’s for the cost of 1 Raptor.
“Really? The F-4 was last built by Boeing in 1981 and there are still many in service around the world. I think Japan has 30 or so still in operation and I know Germany just as many in their air force.”
As I recall Japan has between 109 and 117 in service.
Germany currently has 44 that are expected to remain in service until 2012 when JG-71 transitions to the Typhoon.
Turkey is another major operator with 141 F-4’s in service.
“The F-15s, as wonderful as they have been, have remained essentially static in capabilities, whereas the world, and the Russians have been catching up...and the F-15s are already losing to the Su-33, as the Indian exercises proved.”
Actually, by all rights the F-15 should still trounce the Su-27/30/33/35.
For comparison:
Indian Su-30MKI:
Loaded Weight 54,900lbs
MTOW: 76,060lbs
Thrust to Weight: 1.0
Speed: Mach 2.0
Rate of Climb: 45,275 ft/min
Length: 72.97 ft
Wingspan: 48.2 ft
Height: 20.85 ft
Wing area: 62.0 m² (667 ft²)
Wing Loading: 82.3 lb/ft2
USAF F-15C:
Loaded Weight: 44,500lbs
MTOW: 68,000lbs
Thrust to Weight: 1.12
Speed: Mach 2.5+
Rate of Climb: >50,000 ft/min
Length: 63 ft 9 in
Wingspan: 42 ft 10 in
Height: 18 ft 6 in
Wing area: 608 ft
Wing Loading: 73.1 lb/ft2
Aircraft with low wing loadings tend to have superior sustained turn performance because they can generate more lift for a given quantity of engine thrust. A lighter loaded wing will have a superior rate of climb compared to a heavier loaded wing as less airspeed is required to generate the additional lift to increase altitude.
The F-15 is smaller, faster in outright speed, rate of climb, and acceleration. It has a lighter wing loading, and a better thrust to weight ratio.
The only limitations is that it doesn’t have the independent infrared search and track function, and the AIM-120 AMRAAMs, and the AIM-9 Sidewinders have shorter ranges compared to the AA-10, AA-11, and AA-12 that the Su-30 can carry.
The medium range AA-10 (SARH/IR) depending on model has a max range of 55.9 to 80.77 miles.
The short range AA-11 (IR) has a range of 0.2 to 18.75 miles.
And the medium range AA-12 (Active Radar) depending on model has a max range of 55.9 to 108.7 miles.
The short range AIM-9 Sidewinder has a range of 0.6 to 11.3 miles.
The medium range AIM-120 AMRAAM depending on model has a max range of 30 to 60 miles.
As far as the F-35, check out the Air Force’s FY09 budget request of $1.67 billion for 6 of them.
Most likely over his veto. He has consistently campaigned against the F-22 as a "waste".
With poor judgment like that, I can not see him suddenly seeing the light.
We'll need a HEAVILY CONSERVATIVE MAJORITY REPUBLICAN Congress to pull that veto-overide off. Yes. We all know what the RATs would do...
Elect Obozo and there will be no new F-22’s, plus Obammy would prolly give the ones we have to Hamass
More likely to Castro and Chavez....and the technology to the Chicoms.
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